Sleepy21 said:

hi EM and Quirky

I think sometimes I find it hard when I have a values clash with someone, like if they are not supportive of mental health issues. Those opinions harm others and discourage help-seeking. My therapist said in one case I should try and educate the person, which I did. Who knows if it influenced them at all - but I felt better.

Ofcourse we can try to talk with people who show ignorance of a topic we know well... some people may be open to discussing these things with us.

I guess that's the importance of being an UPstander ie not being a BYstander to things said that we can't let pass by.

By acquiescing and NOT saying anything, this can be taken as agreement.

If we do not agree then we can say so.
If we've been down this path before with same said person on same said topic and it ended up in a volatile conversation then IDK.... it's each person's choice.

I had a conversation on the weekend that I did not bring up.
Other person did.
With same perspective and force.
I said "We've been down this road before. I disagree with you but I'd rather not talk about this topic with you because 'never the twain shall meet' on this - we are chasms apart on our views on this one. Let's leave it."

Lol. It's "left".

After ALL channels of communication are exhausted and it's a frustration just to think of it...
I save my MH and leave it.
I can't spare any MH lol!

Love EM

EM and Sleepy thanks for your comments.

greetings everyone

Sleepy, I sometimes have tried to educate those who disagree or who have different

opinions and values.i do this if I have energy motivation and if I feel the effort is worth it.Otherwise I agree to disagree.

EM your words say it so well.

We've been down this road before. I disagree with you but I'd rather not talk about this topic with you because 'never the twain shall meet' on this - we are chasms apart on our views on this one. Let's leave it."

what do there’s thinks.

Hello all,

I have read on the forums that some people feel disrespected. This makes me sad as I see the forums as a safe place. I know sometimes on the forums and in life people may disagree with me but I know I am treated with respect.

Hi Quirky

I understand you’re sadness. I don’t like to think about anyone here not feeling welcome either.

But I would like to gently share my view that if people are saying they feel disrespected it’s a good thing, as opposed to just walking away feeling hurt.

It’s really positive that people feel comfortable enough to talk about the good and bad of the forum. That means they feel safe to raise a concern and it gives everyone a chance to improve.

Nothing is ever perfect in life and things can only improve if the issues are raised.

This forum is an amazing place, in my humble view, and I tip my hat to you and the other Community Champions who work so hard for the community.

Kind thoughts to you

Thanks Summer Rose . Your thoughtful caring posts help so many including me. I learn from your comments. I have thought thst having a place where people can suggest improvements makes this forum special.

I get upset where people disagree and don’t listen or talk over others.

hi quirky ... thanks for this thread

i had the same thoughts as you and summerrose... i am glad that ppl can speak up. it's powerful.
I was also thinking maybe that it should be even taken another step, and maybe ppl can speak even more about it. Being believed and respected even when disagreeing - wow - that is so powerful.
I've been scared of speaking up for much of my life.

You are very wise and thoughtful to care about the distress others feel here and also to see the value in ppl speaking up. Because many ppl can't do that sadly. I think that is the most damaging. When ppl get the message that it's safer to "suffer in silence" because they can't articulate their pain/concerns safely.

I've suffered in silence a lot and not had the ability to speak. I hope this forum can grow and improve and listen. I can see there are so many different view points on so many issues here! it's a lot to manage and i guess we are all trying our best

Warm thoughts to you

Sleepy,

I am pleased you don’t have to suffer in silence. We all deserve to be heard and if people disagree they do with respect.
take care

Just tagging for now

A lot of interesting food for thought to digest

Paws

Thanks paw prints.

Hey quirky and everyone,

It's probably really important to grasp that people will disagree with us, some times or even alot... they just do and will.

But if we accept that others can disagree with us and that's 100% OKAY then we're getting somewhere.

That means that "you're okay and I'm okay too" - we're okay! We're allowed to disagree.

In fact we can and will disagree with even our very closest friends and ppl in our lives... and we can then STILL love each other anyway. (Ofcourse this depends upon the topic and excludes all types of abuse!)

Perhaps at the core of accepting others disagreeing with us is to embrace the diversity in our circle, on the forums, in our community and in the world.

In fact being able to openly disagree with others, or merely present other POVs is BEAUTIFUL!

It can create a synergy between people that cannot be gained any other way.

We can learn SO much.

yeah I'm gonna quote Brene Brown aaaagain lol... she actually says to "lean into" these conversations, as long as you feel safe to do so is my disclaimer, as they are one of the signs of living a more wholehearted life.

Hope this helps.
Love EM

Thanks EM for your detailed answer.

I agree that people will disagree, I like discussing people who have different ideas.

Sadly there are those people who believe they are always right and then belittle you.

In debating one is told attack the argument but never the person.

we see public figures getting personal instead of arguing a point.

I avoid people who don’t respect my opinions.

Sure quirky!

and that's well within your rights to do so! 100% agree.

The things you mentioned ....

"people who believe they are always right"

"belittle you"

"public figures getting personal"

Sometimes ppl like this are role models of how NOT to behave lol.

I'm certain this kind of stuff is abusive. (Gratefully I never hold politicians in high esteem anyway.)

Soooo once the red flags go UP, it's our decision and 100% right to ignore ignore ignore.

Love EM

Hi Quirky

The last line of your post caught my attention in relation to an issue I’m currently processing.

I hope it’s okay to ask, how does a person show they respect your opinion in a disagreement? Is it enough just to be heard?

Kind regards

Summer rose and everyone,

I think by not shouting, listening and remaining calm when disagreeing. Also say you have listened to their side but have a different opinion, or agree to disagree.

“Looking at things in a slightly different way, have you considered that [concept/perspective] could be a possibility?”

Between the poles,

I do listen to others and consider their perspective.That is a helpful point. Thanks.

I am thinking about listening and being respectful. I do thank you for your contribution. I think we can respect each other with out agreeing and we will never agree with everyone.

Thanks again for your ideas.

Disagreement, in its essence, infers disapproval for one holding a view regardless of how distorted it may appear to the recipient (or even in the presence of cold hard fact) - hence, disagreement is inherently provocative as individual perceptions are pitted against one another and defended more out of personal pride than finding evidencial solutions (as opposed to merely proving one's own case). To disagree is to assert there must be one who is right and the other wrong; thus the presumption of personal slur and subsequent indignation giving rise to elevated tensions. So to 'disagree respectfully' is somewhat of a dichotomy as disagreement is never respectful of the other's view. Equally, 'agreeing to disagree' can be akin to placing one's hands over their ears and shouting lalalala as it signals negotiations have reached an impasse - leaving the resolution hanging in its combative state.
Essentially, one should never feel compelled to disagree with anyone as it purports superiority of one opinion over another.
Perhaps seeking clarification of why someone believes as they do is as far as one should delve to avoid demeaning another's right to hold that view.
Then again, I have probably just demonstrated that I disagree with some comments made here (or even the very premise of this thread!). I don't. You all make your case very well and the message is clear: be considerate and value opinions that differ from your own. The world is getting smaller and we should fear homogenisation of thought.

Hi Quirky and all,

Thanks for this thoughtful discussion. I don’t want to loose track of it, so I’m also just tagging for now.

Lillylane

Tranzcybe

Thanks fir your detailed well thought out post.

I find it interesting how different people can interpret disagree.
I suppose I feel it would not be possible to agree on simple things like what food we like to eat let alone in political and philosophical matters.

I too do not want homogenisation of thought and welcome your ideas which have given me much to ponder.

Lily,and and everyone reading,

nearly a year since I last wrote has much changed. With many differences in how people view vaccines, and the way people see society,

there are many ways that we may disagree with others.

Are you finding it hard to be respectful when you fundamentally disagree with so done who questions your values.?

Hi all

I have strong opinions on some topics and when ppl say things on these topics, I do speak up and disagree.

I also try and learn why they think that and why im so triggered by it,

When I hear ppl say very insensitive opinions against vulnerable populations, usually I'll discuss my feelings with someone who can support me and listen, I don't want to talk to them more when their views hurt me so much.

On certain topics I care about I can only tolerate so much

Eg if someone puts down or degrades abuse victims.

I just walk away.