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Forums / Staying well / WORDS are stick and stones

Topic: WORDS are stick and stones

17 posts, 0 answered
  1. white knight
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    white knight avatar
    9215 posts
    3 November 2014

    We have all been hurt by them yet they do not touch us physically. Words. Sticks and stone will break our bones but words will never hurt me? hat part of that saying didnt get into us at childhood?

    In my late 50's now it was only a few years ago that two separate messages came through via forums or Facebook "go back to your doctor and get some more medication you nutter". On both occasions I sat there stunned. Then came the rebound, the fight was on, the need to correct what was clearly a travesty, an unaccepted form of abuse akin to racial slurs, sexual discrimination and all those things this millennium would no longer tolerate. For I was right, there is no place in todays society for such cruel and unjust abuse. But I forgot one thing.....they said it because they still could say it. No law can gag them.

    So did I do anything wrong? Apart from any provocation by disagreeing with their point of view, my error was to allow these people to effect me with words.Words can be soooo cutting, slicing through every nerve of your soul. Words can come out of the blue and savagely cut through your honour. Words can be from inaccurate to plain wrong. Words can, when coming from a master spin doctor, evil in their transmission, spiteful in ways that many of us cannot fathom because it isnt in our make up...we didnt develop this ability.

    Us with mental illness are more often than those without it, to speak without thinking and speak with truth (my belief). We dont possess the ability to scheme and therefore we are more shocked than others when cruelty arrives at our ears. And the rock throwers know that, they know how to aim at your head with their mean missiles. Of course this is just another reason why some of us retreat to our lair, our safe haven.

    Such words of evil intent also come out of the blue, no warning, no signals. You may have an idea that you dont like these people but still nothing can prepare you for their full armoury unleashed. Words can be unleashed at the worst moments. The weddings, the birthdays, the funerals, public places.

    What can we do? Hard for us to prepare because that would involve planning for words you dont know the content of. You might have the ability to plan a laugh but that would involve some awesome acting on your part.

    What we do have to do, to protect ourselves, is to try to remain invisible. Distance oneself. Cross the road. Categorise these tyrants for what they are- inhuman. For words are weapons. Let them throw them at themselves.

    3 people found this helpful
  2. TheSteve
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    4 November 2014 in reply to white knight

    Cool post White Knight. Let me add a few things:

    - A word is a symbol, and a symbol has meaning; but, meaning is fleeting, temporary, not permanent. "Meaning" can not exist without our identification with meaning.

    - We are conditioned from birth in many ways. Over the past few decades particularly, we have been conditioned to become "sensitive" to a number of insults, slurs, words, symbols, etc. Why are we being conditioned so? Why are we being led down this path, as opposed to the path of dis-identifying with symbols (a much healthier route)? Why are we being ENCOURAGED to feel more strongly toward such symbols? Will these feelings ultimately be used against us?

    - If a symbol has no meaning without my identification with it, then I am in complete control as to how my ultimate emotional response mirrors such symbol. It takes ME, to give that symbol meaning. Therefore, it is mine. I own it.

    - If a person or persons wish to harm me or others using such symbols, will my acceptance of their ignorance help cure them long term (as it has cured me)? What would a counter-attack do? What would a smile do?

     

    The "nutter" comment you received was particularly harsh, thrown by someone whose ignorance, and programmed behaviour, led them down this path. You are the light that will not just eliminate your pain, but cure their ignorance, too.

     Good luck to you my friend, and to all others who have been harmed by words (all of us) at some point in time.

    Steve

    2 people found this helpful
  3. White Rose
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    White Rose avatar
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    4 November 2014 in reply to white knight

    Hello WK

    Wow, your words are powerful. They brought back all the horror I have endured for the past two years. Yes words are powerful.  I am begining to believe that what has been said of me is true. And that is more horrifying than anything I have experienced.  If I am half the things I have been told then there is no room for a person like that in this world.

    I cannot imagine myself saying such dreadful things, whether or not they are true. And yet I wonder where these words come from. How could anyone say something hurtful that they do not believe? And if it is true, why have I not recognised it? I never thought of myself as anything special, but I have always believed I was a reasonably decent person. And yet, because I stood up for what I believed was right I was publicly vilified. And the persecution goes on.

    Like you I have tried to fight it, but the more I try the worse it gets. Lies and betrayals that have knocked the stuffing out of me. Sometimes I can hardly breathe because of the pain. I refuse to hide or go away, although that is the advice from both my GP and psych. It will only get worse they say. But why should I tamely accept this as though it were true?

    Slinking away into a corner, giving up all the work and activities that made my life fulfilling and which I felt was giving back to the community. Now when I try to find a niche I become paranoid about what others think of me and act in a manner that confirms their expectations, or so it seems.

    So if you have an answer I would love to hear it.

    Mary

    2 people found this helpful
  4. dougall
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    207 posts
    4 November 2014 in reply to white knight
    Hi White Knight I think sometimes people don't even hear the words they say when being mean.  If someone recorded them and they watched themselves I am sure they would say I never said that.  People deny all the time being mean.  I had a tyrant of abuse thrown at me Friday night and I was shocked, sat in disbelief, there was so much venom, it was like they unleashed all there pent up anger and frustration out on me.  The only thing I could do as they had hold of me was scream in their face.  I still cannot believe that someone can do that to another person.  I would never in my life talk to anyone the way I was spoken to no matter what they did.
    1 person found this helpful
  5. white knight
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    white knight avatar
    9215 posts
    4 November 2014 in reply to dougall

    Hi all, thankyou for your replies. Steve- very interesting your philosophy there. Makes much sense to me."You are the light that will not just eliminate your pain, but cure their ignorance, too". That took some thinking about. I suppose its all in our control, tucked away securely.

    Dougall- I have lived with (RAAF) , worked with (80-90 jobs) men, cared for (as a prison officer) so many men all my life. And I'm of the firm belief that the men that sent me those messages firmly desired such hurt upon me.

    Some men can be ruthless, and lions in a cage is how some perceive themselves their threats and how they threaten. Show some weakness in the form of tears, sadness or kindness and they will remember it until they desire to conquer you. Then they will attempt to squash you. Once done they will walk down a street with their chest bulging more.  It's my cynical view of some men.

    Mary, you asked if I have a remedy. No, not really. I have a plan of avoidance that does not include remedy as remedy would include mental change, strength and strategies found then implemented that would change thought. To reprogram us. Like super cognitive wonder therapy and meds not developed yet.

    In the meantime my move to the country to place space between me and the masses has worked. But I fell into a trap of signing up with Facebook. That took me back into the crowds, the odd troll and the spite. So 3 months ago I closed my Facebook account and it has proved to me that the calm that has enveloped me since has been profoundly better. I've experimented really on social links like social media. To see where I could exist happily. I've been my own Guinea pig. The calm from that change has convinced me it is the best form of survival that gives the least quantity of hurt.

    Another form of avoiding hurt is to scan for toxic persons. One would see wrong in taking other peoples assessment of others as gospel. But in our case of sensitivity I do listen to others accounts of say, locals that could be a future problem for me. Remain friendly I do but I'm more reserved with those that are known to be confrontational.

    Dodging rocks is much more preferable than licking my wounds.

    2 people found this helpful
  6. white knight
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    white knight avatar
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    8 December 2017 in reply to white knight

    BeeGees verse-

    Its only words

    And words are all I have

    To take your heart away. ..

    Those words arent meant to hurt, shame etc. But words can.

    Words can hurt with the wrong tone and if you are moody tell your partner you are so.

    Prepare them

    Tony WK

    2 people found this helpful
  7. demonblaster
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    8 December 2017 in reply to white knight

    Hey Tony & all

    Putting on my threads

    Cheers

    1 person found this helpful
  8. hello, hi, 😀
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    10 May 2020 in reply to white knight

    Hi TonyWK,

    That was a powerful post!

    Words hurt a lot. Before I was someone who didn't care what someone said to me, but this year and last year have gone so bad that all the bad words that people has said to me before and now, the treatment from people due to the way I look, my race and my weight and the treatment for friends and family come together and hurt me altogether, I can't control it. Everything the people said comes back and all of the mistakes I have made (I have made a lot), I feel like I am bring surrounded by a huge dark cloud. The newer things that people do to me and newer mistakes I make , add to my backpack and is getting heavier and heavier making it hard for me to carry.

    Words most truly and unfortunately really hurt.

    Thanks for your posts TonyWK, they are so true to life and it's like you give a voice to what so many people go through.

    1 person found this helpful
  9. white knight
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    white knight avatar
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    10 May 2020 in reply to hello, hi, 😀

    Thankyou Neerja

    Im glad you benefitted from this thread- there is iver 300 I’ve written for beyond blue!

    another one is-

    beyondblue topic so what are their mental illnesses?

    that one explores odd immature behaviour like bullies and if they do suffer from one.

    If so, for example, then that would make sense. Eg my mother I don’t have contact with. She ruined my first wedding in 1985 and threatened to ruin my second in 2011. But a friend suggested I googled

    witch queen hermit waif

    they are the four possible characters of extreme borderline personalities. My mother fitted perfectly into them! Presto- an answer why her behaviour is so toxic.

    In your case, you have become the target for whatever reason. When I was your age I was also a target and remained so until 21yo when I became a prison officer at the notorious prison Prntridge Jail. There I learned that if I was targeted verbally then to survive my only option was to react louder and more clever than them!

    google

    beyondblue topic wit, the only answer to torment

    beyondblue topic vulnerable dwelling unprotected

    I also learned that fewer words made more impact. And physical assault from someone against me justified equal return otherwise it would keep happening.

    This Neerja is life in our world, like it or not. We can choose to be a victim or we can choose to become equally aggressive to defend ourselves against evil.

    The latter means you’ll live a happier life.

    TonyWK

  10. ecomama
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    10 May 2020 in reply to white knight

    Yes TonyWK, words can be used as a weapon and they can also be used to express love, give comfort, support, save people.

    Demons vs Angels.
    Good vs evil.

    I put on the 'Full Armour of God'. I prayed it many times a day to get through years of Courts.
    The WORST things ever said about me are in print and they are lies. I had no one to support me. Everyone, including my legal team, opposed my path. I tapped in to my instincts to check with myself whether my path was still "right" lots of times. I decided to fight for the truth. Then I prayed, I still put on the full armour. I won magnificently. Thank God.

    Perhaps having an extremely abusive mother calling me disgusting names from a very early age prepared me for life. I developed many sayings that I call on instantly but it took YEARS of practice. My mother was so cruel in her name calling that after a while I could hear the words, know they weren't true and just stare at her. Pfft broken record. No reaction.

    I left home the minute I could. One demon down.

    Evil people find the chink in your armour and shoot. I almost don't have a chink now. No one has found one for a very long time.

    I work in a caring profession and care very deeply. I take points from my colleagues and supervisors seriously and work with them well. We have great professional relationships, except... a new colleague (not used to our culture at work) decided to yell at me across the room a few weeks ago... seriously? I just laughed. What a numpty-noodle. (Mind you it was about my attitude to loo paper! I just said "oh I'm collecting free newspaper so if you see newsprint on my clothes, do let me know lol").. mmm.

    Those who care about me, in my personal life, deliver feedback sensitively. I strive to do the same. I try to apologise the moment I realise I've said something hurtful and if someone says it has hurt them. The same occurs back. THESE people are my tribe.

    But I really don't care at all what anyone else 'thinks' of me. If they are being disrespectful, demeaning, rude or arrogant. I have a radar for that. I simply don't care.

    A friend and I have a saying: "I don't care what anyone thinks of me to a dysfunctional degree".

    Someone else's opinion of you is really none of your business. Like who are these people? What do they even KNOW. The answer is that no one knows you like you do. NO ONE. You know your intent. Choose your tribe and everyone else can go jump in the lake.

    Love to all
    EM

  11. white knight
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    10 May 2020 in reply to ecomama

    Hi EM

    Thankyou for your comments.

    I have yet to master the ability you have of shutting out people that don’t deserve me respect. The guilt instilled in me from a young age is a permanent scar however overall I’ve grown enough to survive with some deep thinking. Not being capable of reading books due to lack of focus/concentration I paved my own road.

    Back to your post. Peter Brock once said “what I’m thinking is personal” and I agree after all if their adverse thoughts aren’t said what hurt can they do.

    Your “tribe” is full of like minded people that have similar values like sensitivity and moral standing. This is what I’ve told Neerja to remember, that her bullies are not worth her time to occupy her mind.

    You are a survivor

    TonyWK

    1 person found this helpful
  12. ecomama
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    10 May 2020 in reply to white knight

    Oh hell yeah, gotta love that 'guilt and shame' load! Not. I am so sorry you still feel that, big hugs. What a crock of coercive control in all that. It's absolutely shocking.

    How I got rid of that, I hope I have, was to actually look at the individuals who put that on me as a child namely mother and father. Like, privately, actually judge them. Score them. Critique them.

    When I worked out what age they were when they were doing this to me and I was about the same age when I was doing this self-examination... woah, that blew me away. My father had died but boy when his brother tried it a bit he was verbally shut down pronto, I maintained the relationship but it got a hellova lot more respectful after that. My mother, it took a major event for NC to occur. Horrible but had to happen.

    I just thought to myself "You simply don't have the credibility to judge me". Would we pay thousands to get financial advice from a broke person? I feel that we pay with our lives; time, energy, focus, mental health, education and all that is lost or negatively impacted by allowing people with zero credibility to make judgement calls on our lives. My parents were in the NEGATIVE of the credibility account. How dare they.

    And would we stand by and watch same people do same thing to little ones in our presence?
    Keep the cycle going down the generations?

    Hell no.

    I sound like a guillotine but I'm not at all. I give LOTS of chances and extend immeasurable kindness and empathy to those in my circle, even by birth. But brother, their load of doggydoodoo is just that. Theirs. Not mine.

    My mental health is way too precious. I've worked very hard getting this far and I'll be damned if some zero credibility person swoops in and sends me down the rabbit hole - I actually call it a slippery slide btw. And to what end? I will say for CONTROL.

    Covey wrote / warns: "We judge other's actions by our OWN intentions". Sensitive souls like us need to know this and remember this when someone else is trying to make us do something. They are not necessarily like us at all. If there is a 'history' of control with this person then that is probably their prime motivation. Maybe their only one.

    Prayers for your healing.

    EM

    2 people found this helpful
  13. hello, hi, 😀
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    11 May 2020 in reply to white knight

    Hi TonyWK,

    Wow 300 posts, that's phenomenal!

    I will definitely read the posts you suggested, they are all amazing!

    Thanks TonyWK,

    Neerja

  14. white knight
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    11 May 2020 in reply to hello, hi, 😀

    Hi Neerja

    a couple Ive found for you to tackle bullies

    beyondblue topic nip it in the bud- ideas

    beyondblue topic overweight? Or over worry?

    beyondblue mars and Venus the conversation between us

    beyondblue topic saving yourself from doom

    beyondblue topic the labyrinth of friendships

    (but don’t forget your school work :)

    TonyWK

    2 people found this helpful
  15. hello, hi, 😀
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    11 May 2020 in reply to white knight

    Hi TonyWK,

    I will read them, they all sound great, as soon as I finish my schoolwork :)

    Thank you TonyWK, I really appreciate it,

    Neerja

    1 person found this helpful
  16. quirkywords
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    24 July 2021 in reply to white knight

    Tony

    just saw this older thread.

    I find words do hurt and as I am sensitive I can recall something someone said decades ago and it will still hurt.

    I dont like conflict so I am sometimes called a doormat as I wont speak up for myself yet when i do speakup I am called butter or angry.

    I am careful not to hurt people with words unless I feel attacked.If I have inadvertently upset someone by my words.

    I agree it is hard to prepare for when someone verbally attacks and calls you names.

    I love words.

  17. wail
    wail avatar
    190 posts
    25 July 2021 in reply to quirkywords
    hello most words i no understand so i hear stupid stupid lots i have anger it is hard i angry lots hard english

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