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Forums / Staying well / Who cries over spilt milk?

Topic: Who cries over spilt milk?

  1. white knight
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    white knight avatar
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    9 September 2014

    That's the saying. "You're crying over spilt milk".  It implies you are hanging onto something that should have been forgotten about many moons ago.  The guilt. The shame. The anger of something past.  If you are one of these people then you have also likely been told "get over it". But I've never seen tablets for sale with the words "get over your guilt with one tablet a day". So what do we do to rid ourselves from guilt?

    There are a number of things you can do to assist in the process of these demonic forms of baggage.   -

    Time-  time is a great healer.  It means you accept that the issue will remain fresh in your mind until a certain amount of time passes. The amount of time depends on the person and the issue. But acceptance by you that time is needed is an encouraging step.

    Perspective- When young, at childs age, we tend to exaggerate incidences. This is quite normal. When we grow up sometimes we hang onto those explosions of fact. This can remain in our minds as bigger than what they really were.  Or smaller too than what they were. Accurate perspective is required and sometimes this is only possible with psychiatric treatment. Correct perspective on a smaller scale however starts with ultimate honesty internally. It is a beginning.

    Forgiveness.  So much time might have passed whereby seeking forgiveness from someone isnt in your best interests. On the other hand seeking forgiveness by a parent to their child might well be in order not only to help with your guilt but to help your child mend. Consider forgiveness from you or to another person. If your efforts were in vain at least you have taken a step towards mending your own ills

    Accepting you are human.  We all make mistakes. Some are unforgivable like sexual harm to a child. Other than those unforgivable acts many mistakes can be redeemed. But one should also accept that if you did the best you could at a certain time in your life then try to accept that. This is where you have to think things through.

    Therapy.  Giving burden to you immediate family isnt fair on them. If you can seek therapy then you are seeking the assistance of someone trained in that field.  Try it.

    Forums. Beyond Blue are anonymous. There is also plenty of reading on such topics there.  That's their advantage.

    Guilt can eat you up.  It can consume you. There is no need to cry over spilt milk. Find ways of dealing with it. Crying over spilt milk is one thing suffering or ruining your life over it is another.

           WK

    3 people found this helpful
  2. JessF
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    10 September 2014 in reply to white knight

    I'm just starting to come out of a two-day fog that has its origins in crying over spilt milk. It has been a nasty couple of days. The thoughts have been very dark, but I have managed them. A year ago I couldn't have done this. 

    Perspective and acceptance are the greatest healers for me. Not to fight against the feelings, beause if you have been betrayed or hurt by someone then of course those feelings are not going to disappear. It would be like falling over and getting angry because there's a bruise.

    A song came on the radio yesterday that matched my situation, and it was enough to lift the fog just a little. It reminded me I am not the first person to go through this, and I won't be the last. The humiliation and anger I was feeling are not going to define me. They are just another episode of life that will seem insignificant years from now. Like so many others before it.

    Thank you white knight.

    1 person found this helpful
  3. Neil_1
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    4232 posts
    10 September 2014 in reply to white knight

    Hey WK

     

    Another awesomely created thread by your good self.

     

    The only time I’ve ever cried over spilt milk was when my son as a young tacker, spilt his milk on a Saturday morning breakfast time.  It went all over my raceguide … I cried but also was angered as well.  Was that wrong to send him to his room?

     

    Neil

  4. Neil_1
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    Neil_1 avatar
    4232 posts
    10 September 2014

    Hi gang;

     

    Ok ok, I was kidding about my last post – especially the part about sending him to his room.  Phew, glad I cleared that up.

     

    All those images you’ve painted are really worthwhile and well worded.

     

    And it’s a lot of these things I feel that possibly affects a lot of us.  I know for me that things that have happened in the past are just in my mind pretty much insurmountable (in that, I’ll never get over them – hope that was the right use of that word).

     

    And things like that leave you scarred – that’s where time heals all wounds – and my play on that is:  time will heal a wound;  but what is then left is a scar.  And depending on the size of the wound, that will determine the amount of scarring there is.  And so, though you’re no longer wounded every day and hurting every day, you have the scar there to remind you always of what it was that led you down that path.

     

    Neil

  5. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    19 June 2019 in reply to white knight
    Hi white night. I'm not sure why you led me to this topic. Maybe I've misread it? Maybe I'm meant to feel guilty and there's something wrong with me for not feeling guilty
  6. white knight
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    white knight avatar
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    19 June 2019 in reply to Guest5643

    Hi

    Not at all. Crying over spilt milk means repeating thoughts and regrets to the point that you suffer guilt over it. Suffering guilt over past decisions is ok to a point as it stops us repeating the same mistakes but if we have learned that then excessive guilt feelings only effect your health causing more suffering.

    Thats from my experience

    TonyWK

  7. white knight
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    10 August 2019 in reply to white knight

    Hi all,

    Dwelling should be classified as a separate illness!

    As a young boy onwards my mother would dig up issues from the past in particular any subject that involved family disputes. In my workplace years later work colleagues would respond to me "are you still talking about that- it's a long time ago- get over it!" Those words "get over it" stuck...and within the embarrassment of the logic of hanging onto past resolved issues, I indeed got over issues better, but not completely.

    Some incidents remain and it is an example of not being able to rid my cyclonic mind from stewing over them.

    So I'm mentioning this because I feel some members might feel bad because they cannot rid their minds of issues totally in particular issues of trauma. A broken marriage, close person passed away or employment incident are all good examples of not being able to stop the effects of spilt milk.

    If that is the case for you and you have tried hard, introduced distractions and counseling and you are frustrated with those bad memories hanging around your guilt factor needs attention.

    Introducing - GUILT the tormentor

    https://www.beyondblue.org.au/get-support/online-forums/staying-well/guilt-the-tormentor-

    Comments welcome

    TonyWK

  8. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    10 August 2019 in reply to white knight

    Hi tony.

    You said in guilt the tormentor 'do you think you need her permission to live without fear,' to do with your narcissistic mum.

    That struck a massive cord with me. Even though my mum is passed away i am still waiting permission from her to tell me its ok. Ive been riddled with guilt for so long for being angry with her for her wrong doings because ive done so many wrong things. She grabbed my arm begged me for help the day she passed away and i ignored her and walked away. By the time i walked back she had collasped. I was in a bad mood that day and i genuinly had no idea what was going on. I had no intention of ever mentioning that but now emotions have flooded out.

  9. white knight
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    white knight avatar
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    10 August 2019 in reply to Guest5643

    Hi Lynne,

    Ok, now I know why you answered in the trigger thread. Oh Lynne, now I know what you are feeling and why you have been effected. I'm so sorry this has happened to you.

    When events occur we should try to make sense out of it when trauma follows. In your case- a seesaw could have emotion/self blame on one side and rationality/realism on the other. Emotion goes up, being realistic goes down, it lessens. We can afford emotionally to push reality away.

    Counselors, psychologists etc can spend time sorting that out to a level of acceptance that enables you to continue in life to an acceptable level of happiness. Someone else that was in your shoes that fateful day might think "well I'm not to blame" and never consider they were at fault at all. So, why do you?

    I'm guessing, because for whatever real cause, you have a fragile heart, guilty concionce and blame yourself.

    In my experience you are the type of person that feels they never do the right thing when at all times realistically you do your best and your best should always be good enough for others and you.

    Excess criticism has led to self doubt. Its a scar. Place those rocks of doubt in a bag...and throw them in a river.

    This is for you.

    NO CRYSTAL BALL

    (To Lynne)

    In that flood of tears you grieve

    There is a bond with that pain

    Mother and daughter and opinions differ

    But it would again

    But we arent perfect as human beings

    Your mistakes are part of you

    That day you couldnt predict the future

    She has forgiven you

    As you wonder what could have been

    If you had your time again

    But you cant be blamed nor tormented

    And pile on your pain

    You did what you felt was best

    No crystal ball in store

    She's hoping you can hear her now

    Dont blame yourself ...anymore...

    Tony

    Whiteknight

    Beyond blue

  10. Guest_9610
    Guest_9610 avatar
    31 posts
    11 August 2019 in reply to white knight

    WK

    What a reply to had posted to Helium!!

    You certainly havent much compassion for someone who's reaching out for some conslance. WK you may be a Champion on BB Forums for many years but that doesn't give anyone the right to be so judgemental.

    We're all here to encourage each other..

    Regards

    Amielle

  11. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    11 August 2019 in reply to Guest_9610

    Hi amelia.

    I found tonys post incredibly kind understanding and helpful.

    1 person found this helpful
  12. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    11 August 2019 in reply to white knight

    Hi tony.

    Thankyou so much for your kind understanding words. I kept reading over and over that poem and i pray one day i believe it. I had absolutely zero intention of mentioning that on the forums but we're human and things come out and then immediatly think oh crap. On the trigger page believe you me i 100% get everything you said. I know everyones post can be a trigger to someone, my posts included.

    2 people found this helpful
  13. white knight
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    11 August 2019 in reply to Guest5643

    Thankyou Helium, Lynne

    I'm so happy you saw my post as reaching out to you in my most kindest way I was able to generate.

    That is your poem, it took me about an hour to write it lol, but it was from the heart as I know exactly what you are experiencing.

    I've noticed you have replied to several other members here with your words of wisdom which is remarkable.

    TonyWK

  14. white knight
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    11 August 2019 in reply to Guest_9610

    Hi Amiella

    I'm sorry you took my post that way. The post was directed to Helium and she received it in the spirit it was intended, to help her and empathize.

    TonyWK

  15. Croix
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    11 August 2019 in reply to Guest_9610

    Dear Amiella~

    May I say I think you have mis-judged?

    This place only has text, and no other clues as to waht is meant, and -speaking strictly for myself - I find i can take the same few words and give them quite opposite and unintentional meanings, depending on circumstances, context and maybe other factors too.

    Thus someone can say to me "you did that ok" and one time I might take that litterally, in other words I did it right, another time I can take it to mean there was room for improvement.

    It is simply a function of the limited environment we are limited to here.

    I have known Tony WK for a long time and know his nature is a kind and compassionate one, not judgmental - except perhaps like many of us - against himself.

    Please don't think I'm criticizing you either Amiella. To spring to another's defense is a worthy thing and you have my respect for being forthright and unafraid to voice concern.

    Croix

    1 person found this helpful
  16. Croix
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    Croix avatar
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    11 August 2019 in reply to Guest5643

    Dear Helium~

    Tony is quite right, and you are a sensitive person, with insight, as you posts to others clearly show.

    Sadly it is so hard to apply that same insight into ourselves, for some reason often it simply does not seem to work.

    I could give you all sorts of logical consolations, and I'm sure they would simply pass by with out touching you - except one. You said "when I walked back"

    In the time between leaving and returning you had changed, if only in mood. We all have to change, and as we do things happen. You mother might have grown to gain a little insight into herself - who knows.

    What I know is you have time to grow, for that guilt to become less as life and your knowledge of yourself and the good you do, the kindnesses you give, the way you approach life and others all takes more and more precedence.

    You are not the same person who withdrew for a little while.

    I too have guilt, one in particular from 30+ years ago. While I regret my actions I no longer think it is the main part of me, there is so much else.

    If I was able to stand outside myself and review my life as it it was that of another I'd note the incident, but only note, and pass on to concentrate on other greater better things that deserved attention more.

    I do not know if any of that will help, all I can say is that from your posts, both elsewhere and above I feel you deserve to feel at ease

    Croix

    2 people found this helpful
  17. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    11 August 2019 in reply to Croix

    Hi croix.

    Hi tony and croix. I cannot thankyou enough the both of you for how much you've helped me with the not so fun part of life from many of my posts including when i was whitewolfwarrior. Ive spoken many times to different psychologists about how my mum passed. She had realy bad emphysema she was only 64 and 34kgs. She got a mucus plug. She was always breathless so i didnt think anytthing was different and when she grabbed my arm realy hard which was her way of begging for help and i said ouch that hurt and kept walking in a foul mood. It just eats me up inside to know how scared she wouldve been and because ive never felt her spirit and every time i grow lavender since she passed it never grows it just wilters i buy lavender plants yr after yr i dont get one single flower and i have regular dreams where shes angry i mean realy angry with me over whatever. So ive taken all that as a sign she dosnt love me anymore. Ive seen countless mediums spent countless money on them. I had to learn the hard way to realise the truth of them. Im not saying theres not genuine ones but i believe thats only less then 1pct.

    That realy is a beautiful poem tony, im going to write it and put in a frame on wall to try help me.

    Cheers lynne

  18. white knight
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    white knight avatar
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    11 August 2019 in reply to Guest5643

    Hi Lynne, you framing my poem is a poets ultimate honour. We have a poets corner here

    In 1996 following my marriage breakdown I told myself daily I was a good person. For 11 years I tolerated emotional abuse so my confidence was low. After 6 months or so it sank in. So reading that poem aloud might help.

    I have some spiritual foundations but I'm solid with logic. Lynne, you misinterpreted your mothers action of grabbing your arm. We are creatures of habit and based on all of your experiences with her you weren't to know, that time was different.

    What occured that day does not define you. The same way a speeding fine doesnt define a doctors worth or how a gambling addiction doesnt defines ones ability to be a life saver.

    We humans are a flawed species. But with good souls they always rear up, show their true colours and expose their love and care.

    Perhaps based on that convincing yourself your worth overall could be better than releasing you from responsibility for that day.

    I'm so glad you are here on the forums. They dont make them like you all the time.

    TonyWK

  19. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    11 August 2019 in reply to white knight

    Hi tony.

    Wow and i mean WOW! I didnt realise you actualy wrote the poem. I just assumed it was one you had heard of elsewhere and chose it cause it suited me. When you said it took you over an hr i just thought you were getting interupted by whatever inbetween typing. THANKYOU!

    Ps my dog barked while i typed thankyou so hes saying thankyou to.

    Cheers lynne

  20. white knight
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    11 August 2019 in reply to Guest5643

    You're welcome. Ive written about 300.

    We have a mini foxy. Great company.

    So to cheer you up-

    THE BLACK WIDOW

    The male black widow spider
    tried all his life
    he tried to tickle the hairy legs
    of his much larger black widow wife

    Then finally he had a win
    something at last to gloat
    she began to laugh aloud
    as his leg slid down her throat

    Poor male black widow
    was always going to get into strife
    all because he didnt understand
    the nature of his hairy wife....

    A SIMPLE POEM


    It was when I worked for Testra I had a bit to say
    after I entered a porta potti on this bright and sunny day
    It was the type on two wheels for workers where they'd moan
    and I decided during this time to write a simple poem

    "Upon the dunny seat where I do my bit...an interesting episode of where my botty sits"

    Well this dunny on a trailer was towed by a fellow mate
    And off he drove to the shop and mi' mouth was just agape

    With mi' undies at mi' ankles and the seat wrapped around mi' neck
    I tried to keep my tender butt from sliding off the deck

    The slop began to lick my bott, sloshing from side to side
    I begged and screamed for him to stop so I could restore my pride

    "Upon this dunny seat where I so my bit...an interesting episode of where my botty sits.....

    WK

    Back to our serious side lol

    There is a man Ive followed for 30 years, a wise man non religious. He has lots of youtube videos. His name in maharaji prem rawat.

    My favorite is (google): youtube maharaji prem rawat Sunset

    And

    Youtube maharaji prem rawat the perfect instrument

    Watch others too. His teachings will help Lynne.

    BLACK CLOUDS DANCING (to Dr...)


    It takes a special kind of man to sense the hurt and grief
    unlike other 'mates' smiling in the street

    They beat their chests all day and never see the harm
    conquer another nameless lady- then return to farm

    No wonder we men grieve, beside us an empty seat
    few mates get to know us nor take the time to greet

    You took the time to trust, you took the time to ask
    it wasnt easy for me to admit...I couldnt do the task

    You saw the black clouds dancing just above my head
    tinted it grey then blew it away by using care instead

    It takes a certain kind of doctor to sense the hurt, the harm, the grief
    thankyou for not being like all the others....that smile in the street....

    TonyWK

  21. Guest_9610
    Guest_9610 avatar
    31 posts
    12 August 2019 in reply to white knight

    Hello WK, Helium & Croix.

    I'm so sorry to You & others on the BB Forum if I've offended anyone by my post to WK last night. It wasn't meant by any ill intent to cause such a havoc to those concerned on the BB Forum. Re read WK post to Helium again this afternoon & came to a realization that "I'm in the wrong" as I Misunderstood of what was written.

    I haven't any other words to express my sincere apologies to Those who I've Unintentionally offended. - (WK) The BB Forum is to encourage & not discourage anyone at all. That's what this forum was designed for in the first place to Encourage each other in their Darkest Times...

    I'm truly sorry & would you please accept my heartfelt apologies to All.

    I've Always struggled in understanding the English language in the fullest context.. am doing my very best for well over 65 years... Still Learning...

    Never To Old To Learn.. & Continue To Do So...

    Maybe I'm not meant to be on BB Forum. Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree so the Aussie saying goes. I do not wish to hurt anyone. After reading your posts, i became very distressed within myself that I could write & upset so many. I'm so so sorry...

    Thank you for having me on the BB Forum yet it's now time for me to move on....

    Thankyou Everyone for being so patient with me.

    Thank you Everyone for your kind generous spirit you show by supporting others in Need.

    Yours Faithfully,

    Amiella

  22. Croix
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    12 August 2019 in reply to Guest_9610

    Dear Amiella~

    Your honesty and ability to see another point of view are an essential here -as are you. Please do not take a misunderstanding as anything larger than just that -a misunderstanding. Nobody has been hurt.

    We all gain if you stay - you, we do , can't put it any simpler. This place runs on the differing experiences, tones and perspectives of everyone here, if it did not have those it would not work.

    I look forward to reading your posts in the future

    At 65 you are only a youngster (by my definitions anyway:) Plenty of time to get used to text-only, adapt and help.

    Croix

  23. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    12 August 2019 in reply to Guest_9610

    Hi Amiella.

    PLEASE DO NOT LEAVE THE FORUMS! You are a wonderful soul and we need your beautiful input here. Ive completely misread posts in the past to see it in a completely different light the next time ive read it. Youve got so many people waiting to be helped by you. Sorry to sound pushy but i cant stress enough how much we care for you. We all make mistakes. I wrote an apology thread just incase ive ever offended anyone in past. If i was standing in front of you now i would give you a hug and say it's ok 👍.

  24. white knight
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    12 August 2019 in reply to Guest5643

    Hi Amiella

    Thankyou, of course I accept your apology. I also hope you stay here.

    Reactions are inground. It takes a lot of effort to change them but add to that, the issue of the written word and we have a powderkeg of unintentional consequences.

    I'd lobe it if you stayed on the forum and worked through this and other issues you have. I'm always learning about myself here.

    https://www.beyondblue.org.au/get-support/online-forums/staying-well/focus-and-never-ever-give-up#qlDA4XHzvGGEbv8AAOnT_A

    Thankyou for your courage. We are here for you, here for each other.

    TonyWK

  25. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    12 August 2019 in reply to white knight
    Wow tony you realy have a talent for poems 👍👍
    1 person found this helpful
  26. Guest5643
    Guest5643 avatar
    460 posts
    15 August 2019

    Im so sorry amielle to see you have left the forums. I hope your ok. Im thinking of you. Lynne

  27. paddyanne
    paddyanne avatar
    127 posts
    15 August 2019 in reply to Guest5643

    Hi Helium. We've all acted without thinking many times then regretted. You didn't help your mum on that last day so your last memory is her reaching out and you ignoring. Can I ask if your mum frequently reached out, or was that a first. If she often grabbed, it's possible you mistook her for 'playing games' and crying for sympathy, in which case ignoring her was automatic. My mother (she's now passed) played the martyr. I ignored her many times. You mentioned you were not happy that day so her reaching out possibly made you feel slightly angry so rather than saying something hurtful, it was easier to ignore. No-one knows what's around the corner. If we all had foresight, many things we do every day wouldn't be done for fear of.... On the other hand hindsight has all of us feeling guilty for looking the 'wrong' way, saying something then regretting it. Rather than torture yourself with what if's and should I have, look on it as human error, which is exactly what it was. I'm sure your mum forgave you, forgiving yourself is accepting. Accept she's not in pain, her suffering is gone. Accept you as you are human with faults and failings. We're all in the same boat. Remember the good times and 'see' her smiling and well. I'll bet you were a good daughter who just had a bad day, nothing else.

  28. white knight
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    15 August 2019 in reply to paddyanne

    Paddyanne raised a good point here with Helium's emotional event and guilt ridden feelings.

    Paddyanne, Lynne read my thread "guilt the tormentor" and connected with it.

    What I want to discuss is the guilt. I have been "studying" or at least thinking about this topic since a teen and I'm 63yo now. Reason is my mother was a nurturer when we were children but she also had a dark side I believe is BPD (undiagnosed which made it harder).

    BPD is very disruptive, manipulative and abusive in some circumstances. So the difficulty would not have been so bad if we didn't have that nurturing side of mum. That side was the side that compelled us to not break away for very long. Up till 2010 my longest break was 12 months. My separation from dad was the painful bit and mother knew it was here greatest asset. Then in 2010 a threat to ruin my wedding (she ruined my first in 1985) was my last straw. I haven't and wont see her again. She is now elderly but if anyone went through what my sister and I endured they'd understand.

    Moving along, I first became aware of her likely condition when I was told to google- queen witch, hermit, waif.

    Each character has their role inside the mind of some BPD people. Switching from one to the other can be instant. I'll leave you to google that so you can get the characters descriptions which is very interesting.

    Now Lynne, I'm not suggesting for a moment your mum had that terrible disorder. What I'm eluding to is the difficulty is "reading" the person. As the waif, My mother was attention seeking and using her emotions to control my father to discipline us when unnecessarily. Another thread on this is

    google beyondblue topic emotional blackmail likely extreme BPD

    Such confusion in never really knowing if your parent is real, acting, attention seeking, manipulating, in need etc is still impossible to tell regardless that you are their child. In my case right up till our 50's we believed we were cruel kids to our mother because- she convinced us, she controlled our emotions.

    I once worked shift work, 12 hours, one day from midnight to noon. I then drove 4 hours to my mothers house and spent 24 hours straight painting it out. I ran out of paint on one small wall in the laundry, it only got one coat but was ok. I crashed for 15 hours sleep. My mother was so happy. Then I found out she told all my relatives and friends that "a good son would have finish it"

    We had to take control, reject her and hope to build our self esteem up.

    TonyWK

  29. paddyanne
    paddyanne avatar
    127 posts
    15 August 2019 in reply to white knight
    Hi Tony. Sincerest apologies if I've stepped on toes re: Lynne's feelings re: her mother's death. As previously mentioned, my mother was the martyr, she played it to the hilt. I understood Lynne had connected the dots with your post. I was simply reiterating your point that guilt can destroy us if we allow it. Thinking after about what if, should have, doesn't help. I've had to divorce those negative emotions in connection with my mother, her death, my reactions etc. I felt immense guilt because I wasn't there. I live in Oz, she was in N.Z. Had I been there, nothing I could've done would've stopped her death. It was her time and no matter the sequence of events, she died alone. Unfortunately no-one can predict when someone's time has come. Everyone feels guilty and thinks, if only.... All anyone can do is cherish the time we have and do our best. I'm sorry about the way you were treated, it must've been hard to make the decision to reject her. You tried your best and it wasn't enough. She failed you, you did nothing wrong.
  30. white knight
    Community Champion
    • Outstanding members who have volunteered their time to support others here on the forums
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    white knight avatar
    9216 posts
    18 August 2019 in reply to Guest_9610

    Hi Amiella,

    I'm checking up on you if you are still browsing the forum. I'm hoping you are ok and want to let you know we are very understanding here, in fact it is our greatest ambition to reach out to everyone. We all misunderstand things at times.

    Regards TonyWK

    1 person found this helpful

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