Hi Blue!

Ok so the meds had more side effects than relief. Awful.
It's such a shame, having some hope that there'll be a massive mountain of relief, sadly it wasn't the case. I had similar, horrible. I'm exponentially better off without ADs.
Avoiding alcohol completely for me was a huge leap up in my outlook on everything. Alcoholism runs in my family so it was a THANG to stop. Also demon is an alcoholic, luckily I didn't drink his stuff anyway.

Sorry it turned out that way. I see what Croix says about all the time, stress, money wasted in seeking an answer via meds, I agree.

You & Croix are so cultured! Hahaha. I was into music big time once being a dancer. Not so much atm.
For now my culture is being an acnephiliac! HAHA, big time. Not sure the term about ear wax removal clips... BF said to me today that it was probably the same "addiction", I agreed lol.
If I'm working hard in the house or garden, I LOVE to hear others working hard too.. so I listen to clips of lawn mowing and drain cleaning, oh so lovely.

Blue, infidelity is such a destructive element to a committed relationship, it can never be underestimated!
It literally BLEW up 3 of my families in my own life, so that's HUGE!
This last one was the worst for me, bec it's a demon lol. But to think it used my body "unlawfully" in my books - I see that as putting my life at risk without me knowing, used me as a "free atm" as the kids put it etc etc blah blah, whilst all the time BETRAYING me?
Blew it up.

I get it 100%!!
In one fell swoop our entire lives were forever changed. THANK GOD in hindsight!!
What sickened me to the core (past tense bec it's done).. was that it ENJOYED it.
It actually enjoyed "getting away" with betraying me all those years. Disgusting.

The little trust I had left evaporated instantly.

The psych I saw days after I found out, answered my qn as to WHY I felt this so deeply?
She said you are feeling this as deeply as the commitment and investment you'd put into him AND the marriage and family.
DEEP ALL RIGHT. Decades ugh.
Even my GP helped me get my head straight too... by saying Look at this like a business contract... Would you go into Business with this person?
BLERGHHH Never!

I validate your feeling exactly!

How are things going financially now you have the new mortgage?
I love that you could reduce your days at work by a tad!
I must post on your Finances Thread soon.

How is LMs Course going?
What is he studying if you're happy to share?

Love EMxxxx

Hey EM,

Yay, your post came through!

Even the relief was short lived, EM. The side effects ultimately made the ADHD symptoms worse. Sorry to hear you had such a bad experience with ADs. They helped me a lot, within hours of the first dose, so I got lucky there. It wasn't too likely to happen that way again, I guess. Yes, a lot of time, cash and energy get wasted trying out meds. I don't think they're the answer to a lot of things, but according to my research, ADHD tends not to respond to therapy/techniques/etc. without them, it's brain chemistry not a way of thinking. Blarg.

No harm to come of avoiding alcohol. I'm partial to it myself but with everything going on haven't really felt like drinking for ages, certainly no signs of an addictive personality here. Shame not to use my cocktail making stuff, though. Mocktail time, mayhap!

Cultured is relative. We do love our music, though. I'm listening to Tokyo Cafe now, a livestream of mellow jazz on YouTube. You've mentioned acnephilia before, even saying you wished you had some of your own to pop. As someone who has had severe cystic acne, I'd gladly never see another pimple again. Trust me, you don't want them. I'd have to say the gross body stuff and the lawn mowing sounds aren't my cup of tea, but I'm glad you're enjoying them.

Yes, it's very destructive. I thought all the same things about the potential danger, and if there could be a child out there born of such disgusting behaviour, all of that. Mind you, my ex differed from yours in that he didn't attempt intimacy with me after he did what he did. I immediately knew something was amiss and he told me within short order. Even so...

Good point about the damage being relative to the commitment/investment you put in. After a lifetime of not having the ability to be vulnerable and connect with anyone, I had started to with him. Not an easy thing from my starting position in life, and where I had had emotionally unavailable and unreliable people to deal with before, there I had outright betrayal. I expanded on that a bit in my PTSD thread, but that's the gist. It wasn't just what he did, it built on an already shaky ability to trust. Anyway, I appreciate the validation and understanding.

Money is tight, largely because I dropped a shift, can't drop any more for a while, sadly. Not too tight though, we're okay.

LM's is studying geology. It's interesting, and going well. He's on uni holidays at the moment. I'm enjoying having him home.

Blue.

Hey Blue! I'm on a roll lol!

I napped after writing here then woke up and thought I bet Blue has come back on. And you had! yay lol.

Snap about the infidelity stuff. I totally get it! I felt extremely validated by the online forum I joined back then, which was the extreme OPPOSITE of what I was being told by demon and it's family. "Get over it" and "EVERYONE does it" and so much more.
Who ARE these ppl? Born on the dark side IMHO.
Regardless of what anyone else thinks, it was devastating and is only ever destructive. NO GOOD comes out of it except whatever jollies the affair partners get - which I find matches specific personality disorders.

I "get" where you started from. Mine being similar. I'd been betrayed by my previous H too and I left with the kids, plus my own father had done same in the worst of timing for my mother and our family. It was brutal what that person did.
Betrayal on the deepest of levels.

Yep I understand ADHD will not change, similar to autism.
I work with mine, I totally support anyone seeking help though! In whatever forms they take. More power to you!

But I also empathise with you that it can be a long haul.
If you're taking ADs, do you think the mix of meds could have some impact?
Drs tried all sorts of ADs on me over the years.
It is different, in lots of ways.
My sadness was more based in reactions to series' of life changing events, death of close loved ones, a mother with wild MIs, then NC, violence, grief of my children, ofcourse the abuse of us all too. All whilst working to keep a roof over our heads and food on their bellies.
Not to mention massive Courts' action, reporting on so many levels, Police intervention - all I find far too overwhelming.

It's over atm. Could just be a pause. Demon has 2y left to challenge the Court's decisions in Family Law ie to get more money out of me. I Pray they throw any application OUT. I locked everything down legally through Courts the very best I could! Better than any Lawyer or Barrister thought necessary - but they didn't know demon like I do.

Cocktails sound fun! Hahaha.
Gosh those were my younger days!

Geology, wow! One grandson LOVE rocks. My family were "Lapidarians" hahaha.

I need to get to bed. Poodle is barking frantically and if we're all in bed, we stand more chance of him settling down.
More pimple popping. I don't actually wish I had them, well a few might be fun, maybe.
I watched ear wax removals and got hooked. That's fun!

EMxxxx

Hey EM,

Yup, you got me. :)

Yeah, really sounds like demon and family were seriously messed up. Infidelity is certainly a common thing, people are driven by their private parts and weak of will, but "everyone" does not do it, it is not okay, and you don't just damn well "get over it". No, no-one benefits from it. I know "open" relationships are a thing for some people, and I don't get it, but at least there's no deceit involved. It is the broken trust that really makes it the destructive thing that it is.

I know you have a history in your own relationships and seeing it in your parents. As far as I know that hasn't happened in my previous relationships or with my parents. I know my father threatened going elsewhere if he didn't get what he wanted from my mother, that's a whole other mess that's equally not okay. Seriously, what is wrong with people?

Yeah, it's frustrating that it's something you can't change without meds. I've lived with it a long time, I have some strategies & can keep doing it if I must, but I'm so tired. I want less to fight against, all I've ever done to get any hint of peace in life is fight. Sure I'm good at it, but I'm also sick of it, it's not good for me.

No, I'm not taking ADs. I've been on and off them over the years, never want them longer than it takes to kick a real bad episode. I'm used to my base level depression and can navigate it most of the time without meds. Could be that between spikes it's just dysthymia, I dunno.

There really wasn't any reason for you not to be sad, going through that. Not necessarily the same as clinical depression, though one can lead to the other as in my case. It doesn't look like ADs were the answer for you, in either case. Two years is a long while for you to be wondering if your livelihood will come under attack again, it's crap you're in that position. I don't blame you for being very thorough about locking things down.

Cocktails are fun. Mocktails too. They're kind a social thing though, and we're sure not in a position to socialise, these days. Lockdown here now, so my few social plans are straight out the window.

It's a pretty cool topic. He's less on the rock polishing side of it than looking at the history and environmental side of it all.

Hopefully Poodle calmed down with everyone in bed. Have fun with the gross body stuff videos, I'll leave those for you, might watch drawing tutorials instead. Did I tell you I've been drawing some things?

Blue.

Day 1 on new meds. Stomach is a bit funny, I feel kind of tingly and weird. Both annoying, but not overly problematic. Dunno if it's doing anything with my symptoms, it's too bloody cold for me to be keen to try doing any tasks I might normally have difficulties with. Will monitor.

Lockdown begins, I am an essential worker, so the only place I'm allowed to go is the one place I don't want to, where the customers are all in a panic but respond with buying a million packs of toilet paper instead of social distancing (i.e. getting out of my face). I am sick of this situation of my need to put food on the table putting me in the way of a danger to my partner. I'm not okay with it.

Dear Blue (but no wave to EM while she keeps describing certain actions 😫)~

My meds -which work well and are not ADs - far from it - can upset the stomach and cause mild tingles, however these are minor probs and they do work. I hope yours do something useful too. The merry-go-round of different medications is so wearying and can seem pointless (which was how I felt until these came along)

I remember you talking about a previos Covid panic which no social distancing and your boss one of the worst -I wish it could be different for you.

Maybe this will help a daydream

Paul Cauthen – Resignation

Croix

Hey Croix,

Thanks for dropping in, I know you have your own concerns at the moment.

Unfortunately many meds disagree with the digestive system. Considering the benefits, I'm glad your side effects don't bother you too much. So far what I've had isn't too bothersome, but it's only day 1. We'll see how it goes from here. Yes, the merry-go-round is rather tiresome, and I've barely started. Blarg.

Yeah, there was a lot of that. At least this time we're actually in lockdown and masks are mandatory for everyone. That will help. Also that particular boss and her second in charge are long gone, so no more of those two idiots running around hugging everyone. That was a nightmare.

Fun song. I sure would love to hand in my resignation, and maybe do a little dance at them when I do. That said, I'm doing a lot less hours than I was and there are more senior staff to fall back on these days, it's better than it was.

Blue.

Hey Blue

Just saying a huge thankyou for your kind post of care just after Prince passed away (*but no wave to Croix while he judges others😆)

You have been a part of the forums for a long time Blue....Its really knocked me around..Im just starting to find my feet after Prince died

It takes a very special individual to notice someone that is in bad place

Thankyou so much for being the special person you are and have always been

Paul x

Hey Paul,

No worries. I wasn't sure if you saw it, that thread got super busy just after I posted.

I did notice you posting a lot less often in the threads we both visit. It's understandable, no-one just gets over losing their best friend, it's a time for you to make your own healing a priority for a while.

Thanks for the kind words. We've known each other a long time, and Prince in his own way has been a special part of the forums, some of your memories of him are shared by various of us here. He will be missed. Always here to listen if you need.

Blue.

Excuse me Blue while I extend my deepest sympathies to Paul losing Prince, I'm so sorry Paul. I didn't know until now or else I would have sent my condolences earlier. It doesn't matter how "old" our dear pets are or how ill they get either, the shock of the loss and the hole they leave in our lives is drastic.
You've had a real lot to deal with this year Paul. Hugs and lots of love and caring energy coming your way.
So sorry. EMxxxx

Also thanks for having my back re: watching all that gunky yuck stuff getting OUT of people's bodies!
I cannot watch if blood's drawn ewwww, no, I fast forward those bits.
I find it all quite cleansing and refreshing lol!

Croix, dear friend, we can celebrate our differences lol!!

Hey Blue, omg poodle is at it again grrr. Barking like mental.

I saw you'd started your new meds?
How are you going with it all?
I really hope THESE are the answer you're seeking. Hugs.

Re: infidelity (for some) definitely breaks TRUST and it's 100% BETRAYAL. Also the entire future we'd "planned together" is gone in an instant. It's all just baloney.
Oh it's not 2 years, it's 2 MORE years. 5-7y are precedents set previously so I'm just Praying tbh.
Since our neighbour's house sold for over $1 million on the w/end - a 2 bedder fibro majestic on less land... and I "paid out" on a Valuation of $600k on a much bigger and better home and land area, demon would be seething and attempting all sorts. So far to no avail.
One word, diddums lol.

Work during lock down OH the fun of it!! Not. I know whole families who are "stuck" at home, almost total restrictions of their work and movements.
US not at all tbh.
We are so stretched trying to meet our work's NEEDS during LD, everyone in my entire family is so much busier.
I'm handling this LD a lot better than last year's, Thank God, BUT my work is 10 times more this time.
I'm exhausted. Going in to work tomorrow to help salve some situations. Then Mon for 12 hours too, but I also have to work all weekend just to get all sorts done asap. So much pressure.

I wish I COULD have a cocktail lol, but I'm doing so many drop offs and pick ups and Learner's hours, at all hours. Just too tired to drink lol. A billion cups of tea is my thing atm.

I really love watching ingrown hair removals too, just FYI hahaha!

Catch up soon
Love EM

Hey EM,

By all means, my thread is open to address any others dropping in, we're all in it together.

Oh dear, seems Poodle is in need of lots of attention.

Re meds - the side effects I mentioned have dimmed to pretty much negligible. Down side? No noticeable improvement in ADHD symptoms whatsoever. That said, doc put me on a very low dose (below normal adult starting dose) in light of the disaster that was the last attempt with meds, so at least my wellbeing is being considered - that's nice. I presume my next appointment will result in an increased dose.

Yup, you're spot on about infidelity. Even if you try to rebuild trust and go for that future, it's always in the back of your mind undermining your efforts. Doomed to failure, almost certainly.

Urgh, I don't envy you in that situation. The selling prices of houses in your area are definitely going to draw demon's attention. I sincerely hope all the work you did to secure your finances is enough.

Honestly, I wish I could be in lockdown during lockdown with everyone else! I'm loathing the madness at work, the sheer panic. The increase in workload is unbelievable. Even with a heap of extra people on, we just don't have the equipment to achieve the goals they've set for us. It's ridiculous. I'm coming home and just falling asleep on the couch - as an expert in all forms of exhaustion, this is about as exhausted as I've ever been. It's unreasonable. Sounds like it's the same for you and your family. I wish it wasn't like this for any of us.

There's still mocktails, EM, all the frills, none of the impairment. :) Tonnes of coffee for me.

I'll leave the gross videos to you, you can have them all to yourself!

Back to the topic of finance, I got so much back in tax this year (presumably because I've dropped a lot of hours and had already paid quite a bit in tax before that), I have been able to wipe out some major bills for the whole year ahead. What this means is I've just about made up for what I would lose in the next entire year if I drop one more day per month. It is looking feasible, and certainly desirable given the insanity of the current situation with covid. Bring it!

Blue.

Dear Blue with a wave to EM~

I've been listening to your conversations about infidelity and have to agree that trust broken cannot be 100% restored, no matter what. I've been lied to and betrayed by workmates, put up with self-seeking lies by others that have been a threat to me and all the normal gamut of human dishonesty.

People talk about the ability to trust being totally gone, I'm not sure about that. I've trusted both my wives totally despite all my experiences and have 'emotionally invested in them' as heavily as one can. So I'd say for some, no matter how harshly life has deal with them there might be a little hope.

That being said if either wife had strayed trust in that person would be gone as it would be if the positions were reversed and I strayed.

I'm not belittling infidelity, it is a totally deceitful self-centered practice where the partner and probably any family is devastated. Actually the one that was strayed to may most likely get betrayed also. "I'm going to get a divorce" can be a favorite line spoken with little or no intention of doing so.

https://www.beyondblue.org.au/get-support/online-forums/long-term-support-over-the-journey/i-am-the-'other-woman'-and-i'm-not-evil-

Is an example. I have sympathy and respect for Zenobia.

I know you might think my expereices have not involved a partner so my judgment is not valid. Maybe you are right, however perhaps one might consider the relationships in my (ex)job between colleagues as coming close.

Croix

Hey Croix,

I think that lies and betrayal in friendships aren't so very different, if to varying degrees depending on their nature. In police work, such things could be potentially very dangerous, so I can see your point - you'd really be watching your back if it happened there.

I agree about the ability to trust. I think it can be nurtured back to some form of life, but it sure takes a lot of work and careful handling. Many people don't have that luxury. I have been lucky to eventually find a partner who takes my trust seriously. I do trust him, though I still have moments of paranoia and difficulty, which he does handle with due care.

I know you're not belittling infidelity, it definitely ends trust with the individual(s) involved. I'm going to step back from any sympathy to the person "strayed to" however. If that person has knowingly become involved with someone already in a relationship to the point of "I'm going to get a divorce" (as opposed to "I am divorced") having any meaning, then they are every bit as guilty as the party saying it of selfishness, weakness of will, cruelty and irresponsibility. I have seen the thread you linked - it triggered me the first time and is doing the same now. I should perhaps step back from saying anything specifically about that.

Your thoughts and experiences are different to mine, but perfectly valid. The impact or direct consequences of infidelity vs work relationships gone sour are certainly different, but I would say some level of comparison for understanding is definitely there.

Blue.

Dear Blue~

My apologies for mentioning that thread, in no way would I wish to cause you any distress.

"Nurting trust back to life" is an excellent way of putting it, as it does take another to do the nurturing, a special people. Also it implies the potential to trust again is often still buried inside a person, even if not in use. A messages of hope

Menagerie are actually awake, though Foxy Dog resembles a ball of mud on 4 skinny legs with muddy blobs for paws ATM, been for a walk with Mrs C and she managed to find the most horrible places to romp in (no, not Mrs C, I mean Foxy Dog)

Croix

OMG Blue! Pardon my focus being straight on to your tax return, wiping out some bills!
Possibly being able to drop another day!

omg, I'm so excited for you... MARVELLOUS news.

The relief is tangible. lol. Phew.

Nice ones.

Hey Croix and anyone reading too!

I began writing a post dealing with the infidelity tooing and froing but deleted it. I'll say a few things further down.

I won't get into another divergent tangent on your thread too Blue!
IDK how LONG it will take me to recover from the stuff on mine.

Oasis.

I am SO hearing you about the lock down mad ness!
EXACTLY the same things are happening at our work with impossible demands on my time.
Impossible every thing.
I've had to be on site, and some NEVER have to, not bec of illness either. GRRRR.

ALL the affirmations of "I'm grateful I have a job... " etc etc are not cutting it atm.

Re: the cheating garbage.... NO WAY IN hell would I ever have sympathy for an affair partner lol!!
Cheeses! Where on earth would that thought even come from?

That's EXACTLY what Narcs feed off of.
Sympathy.

Narcs are definitely one extremely selfish group of ppl who commit adultery. Nope no way Jose!

For me FOR YOU, this is nothing about the cheater or the affair partner.
There are multiple sites to help you work out THEIR MH disorders.

This is about YOU Blue.

YOUR recovery from infidelity.
No one else.
Just you.

Because YOU are important.

You are deserving of a loving STABLE relationship with a beautiful human.
I AM SO GLAD HE'S THERE with you right now.

All the feelings that come in right now for you ARE real.
They have a direct line BACK to that offender.... then precursors to the parent / child stuff.

But no way if someone came in and obliterated someone's home, threatened their ability to work, took their relationship away entirely and left.... would that person be "okay with that".

LM IS a different person thank God lol but it is STILL an intimate relationship you have with him.
So there's the thing.

Now you're engaged to be married, this can bring another wave of doubt, questioning, intrusive thoughts... just stuff from your past. Not bec of LM.

You aren't denying yourself marital bliss (lol) and you're showing resilience and courage in taking this step.

The progress is seemingly apparent.

Is this how you feel?

How are you feeling?

Love EMxxxx

Hey Croix,

I didn't assume you meant any harm by sharing that link, though if I'm to be honest, I'm a bit perplexed about why it seemed like a good idea. I've heard plenty of arguments from the other side of affairs, not one holds water and I have no interest in hearing any more of them. The consequences perpetrators face are their problem - they made their choices. Me, I get the consequences anyway (likely more and worse), and I didn't have the luxury of choosing not to bear them.

Yes, that potential to trust is buried deep. Very deep. And unlike many things in healing, this is one that requires another human to be on board and trustworthy. That's the real kicker. It's been a hard road.

Menagerie awake for once. Remarkable. I laughed at the idea of Mrs C romping in horrible places. Has she muddy paws (or perhaps flippers) as well? Sir Pecks is napping beside my printer at the moment, & Mr Feisty is atop the hallway door, having a quiet sing. A rare luxury to have a serenade from Mr Feisty.

Blue.

Dear EM,

Thanks, this is definitely a significant and important change for me. No "possibly", I'm dropping that day as soon as possible. Have spoken to my manager already, she is supportive (probably because it's a headache giving other staff the hours they want and I'm freeing some up for her).

No, let's not do divergent tangents. It's gonna take me a while to recover from things on your thread, too. I do want to say I think you were not just courageous in what you said, but also respectful and eloquent in reinforcing your boundaries. And thank you for backing me up. I know I opened a Pandora's Box, it didn't feel good doing it, but I could see what was happening and I couldn't be silent.

I know you understand better than anyone how nuts it is for some of us working through lockdown. I hear you about the affirmations not cutting it, too. Just got my head down, bulling through what I have to. I've built up a small amount of leave again, trying to book in a mini holiday, hopefully no meds debacles to ruin it this time. Ugh.

I knew you'd get my stance on affair partners. I ended a friendship with someone who chose to become one, and I stand by that. We keep people near us that reflect our own values - everyone else can get outta here! That said, it means I have very few real friends. Quality over quantity and all that.

Yeah, the adulterers aren't our problem. Their MH, their consequences... they didn't give a damn about ours, we are giving enough by walking away and living our own lives.

You said: "This is about YOU Blue. YOUR recovery from infidelity. No one else. Just you. Because YOU are important." Thank you for these words. You are the one person who has not only recognised and validated the impact of this on me, but also been willing to talk and listen about it. It's one subject that LM understands and supports me about, but it isn't for him to hear intimate details about my past relationship, that just isn't fair on him. It would hurt me for him to do that to me, so I won't do it to him. Does leave me in a bind, though, he's the one IRL person I can be that open with. Sigh.

He is a beautiful person, we are stable together, it is comforting. Yes being engaged comes with some insecurity, I was engaged to the ex and things went extra sour once the ring was on the finger. I do talk about this with LM when it comes up. Yes, it's progress. Scary, but progress.

Out of words. Kind thoughts to you, friend.

Blue.

Dear Blue

Kind thoughts to you too.

I totally get not feeling it appropriate to talk about intimate details of that past r/ship with LM.

It's VERY hard to have similar things like an Engagement happen, again.
Then do a POWER POSE and go for it.
I hear you.
Tons of stuff has come up since I "got engaged" this time.
When the ring arrives, probably MORE!

And it's supposed to be a "happy time" yay yay yay and inside there's this thing that's going on like.... Do I REALLY want to do this again?

I've had this convo with BF numerous times.

He is noticeably a completely different human being (to demon) on probably EVERY level lol.
Even his ACCENT is totally different.

Still.... you and I feel the level if vulnerability we are risking.
We KNOW the hurt potential.

I know you don't like quotes BUT from Brene's Ted Talks and Netflix etc... her Research proves that to have Joy, Love, Happiness in life.... we need to be vulnerable. NOT comfortable with it! No one is!
Just KNOW it.

So say you and I have a vulnerability level of 99 or 90 out of 100.
That's our v score lol.

Mustering UP the courage to know what FEELING that score feels like... then taking that and RISKing it all on our next partner.
THAT'S courage.

She proves it.

Letting that sink in...

OH YEAH dropping a day sounds so good for you Blue!
A work / life balance is so different for each person.
The QUALITY of your life part is a really healthy focus. I'm watching and LEARNING lol.

I'm so happy for you and that's BEAUTIFUL.

The Puffballs agree, my chickens told me this morning lol.

You know, we're just going through life, doing the best we can with what we can access.
We experienced trauma not only from that horrid experience of infidelity but also from childhood.

So we are in recovery.

We really are doing so well. I'm so proud of you.

I THANK you so much for having ALL the bravery I could not display on my thread.
It was killing me throughout the week that I knew this would be triggering for you!
If it triggers me then it triggers you - I pitch.
I tried to be gentle and polite.

I called 2 helplines at 4am this morning. I'd slept solidly but then woke in an adroit state, hyper alert, hyper vigilant.... no, not having it.

And the thing persists on my thread! lol that's the name for it.

Going back in to clear my loungeroom OR get some VERY CLEAR Meeting Norms understood.
Herein lies the issue, explicit communication with NO comprehension!

Armouring UP!

Love ya MOUNTAINS
EMxxx

Hey EM,

Just a quick note as I'm dog tired & heading to bed - I have some very early starts ahead of me. Will respond more fully in our various threads as time and energy permit. For now, just want you to know I'm listening, and your words are understood and valued.

Blue.

Hey EM,

LM Doesn't have the same sensibilities I do, but he gets why I don't think it appropriate to really get into it with him. I do tell him about little bits of it (if not in great detail) if they become relevant, i.e. something triggers me in his presence.

Mostly my focus is on LM, I wasn't thinking of the past when I proposed. Insecurities have come up though, as they will before a wedding. It was a very long engagement with the ex, that clearly went nowhere. I definitely don't want that again, we are agreed that we want to be married within a year and not stagnating. That helps.

You're not kidding about the potential for hurt, it certainly gives one pause at times, doesn't it? It must be worse for you, being so far from BF - physical presence does a lot for accepting reassurance. For my part, living with LM for a time has made a huge difference, I see every day how committed he is to me and the birds, and to really being present in our relationship, not just physically in the vicinity. I have needed a lot of proof of that to be able to let the walls down, I can tell you!

My work/life balance involves as little work as possible. I find with the ADHD all things take me a long time and a lot of energy, so I have to allow so much time for everything at home, from basic housework to merely falling asleep. Need 8 hours sleep, account for 9-10. Doing dishes? Account for 1-2 hours of getting distracted and forgetting what I was doing in between. Etc., etc. with every damn thing. So yes, cutting shifts where possible boosts my quality of life, I can get a few basic things done without being stressed to hell. If my example helps you too, then great. Mind you, LM has been instrumental in encouraging me to put that quality of life first and (unlike various exes) not heaping extra responsibilities and expenses on me.

Yes, we're in recovery. Both doing pretty well considering. I'm proud of you, too.

If there's one thing I do with triggers, it's fight. For me, for you, for probably a bunch of people reading along and feeling the same. I wonder sometimes if my purpose in life is just pointing out the elephant in the room...

I'm sorry you were put in the position of needing to call helplines. That really sucks.

I know you've had a lot of boundaries to uphold, lately. It's not easy. You're doing great.

Blue.

Triggered to all hell last night. Yet another night of neighbour BS. I will never understand why it's so difficult for people to show any decency to others around them. I think it's been about a year of it this time around. Was 6 or so years at the last place, throughout the last of which I was calling cops very regularly and getting nowhere. Cops don't care, council doesn't care, why does a shift worker getting any sleep - like, ever - matter, right? These nights it really drives home how whether it's parents or various partners throughout my past, or the "system" in trying to get mental health help, and of course this BS in trying to get some consideration in being allowed the basic courtesy of goddamn sleep... I just live at the bottom of anyone's priority list. It's honestly a wonder that I don't have all the self-esteem troubles my sister does, I've been shown since the minute I was born that I just don't matter. How do you come to terms with that? Even with the loving, supportive partner I have now, I continue to see the "YOU DON'T MATTER!" message bashing me over the head from almost every other angle. How does an individual manage to get to this age with so few people managing to even give them basic courtesy? You know, the kind that doesn't even require knowing/caring much about that individual. I just don't get how people are like this.

Dear Blue~

To a select few you matter a lot, starting with your LM plus EM, myself and others here. In fact you have inside you the conviction you do matter too, if you did not you would not ring the cops (useless or otherwise) and would not expect better of others.

I can't answer for others in the human race, though on occasions I've been pleasantly surprised.

I hope you manage some rest and find some solace in the Desiderata (which helps me) and your puffballs.

Croix

Dear Blue

This stuff going on with the neighbours is not about you at all!
Ppl like that, who disturb the peace whenever it takes their minds to let loose are doing just that, LETTING LOOSE.

Ofcourse neighbours living in close proximity of each other SHOULD be considerate of their actions and the consequences for their neighbours.
IME they aren't.

They're just selfish ppl.

I don't know what you do about ppl like that, I really don't.
You've done your best to alert authorities, what else can you do?

We have 2 sets of similar neighbours. One lot party ALL the time. doesn't have to be a weekend, any night is party night.
Now a neighbour a way down must be drinking heavily every day. Then goes outside and throws up loudly, yells and screams and wash rinse repeat for hours. I'm like what the??

My kids all bought themselves noise cancelling headphones. Mainly so they could listen to their own shows and study without disturbing others or being disturbed.

I know it's not fair to suggest this, but that's what I'd do if I were you.

Blues ofcourse you'll be triggered by all this stuff and the life stuff too...
I agree with Croix wholeheartedly. You KNOW your worth, regardless of anyone else's actions in the past and present.
Please know you ARE important.

You are a VERY significant friend to me! One of the very few people on earth who understands me.
I've LAID things about me and you STILL talk to me lol!

I appreciate you so much.

Take care my friend. Hope you get some good quality sleep!

Love EMxxxx

Dear Croix,

Objectively I know you're right - and thank you for saying I matter to you. One likes to think so, but hearing it directly from others can make a striking difference. Yes I do have the conviction that I matter, though life has left me with battered confidence about whether others agree. That is the loudest voice when I am triggered, unfortunately.

The human race at large is predominantly self-absorbed, in my experience, but yes - occasionally individuals will surprise me.

I rested eventually, albeit less than I needed to. I had to look up the Desiderata. I'd heard of it, but not observed in detail. I did find a video on YouTube of it being read by Leonard Nimoy, which added a layer of interest for me. Puffballs are always a source of solace.

Kind thoughts to you, Mrs C & the Menagerie.

Blue.

Dear EM,

Yeah, I know. It's all about them, not giving a damn about anyone but them. What gets me is not having a reasonable recourse for dealing with repeat offenders. The system says the one being harmed by the bad behaviour gets punished, not the person responsible for it - I get to lose sleep if I do nothing, I get to lose sleep if I call cops, I get to lose sleep if I try to drown it out with noise, I get to lose sleep with earplugs or headpones or whatever because they are not made for lying down with (notwithstanding my sensitivity to having anything on my head or in my ears, it's extremely uncomfortable and unpleasant for me). Ultimately my punishment for the person at the last place was being driven out of my home and into financial ruin. What consequences did they get? Absolutely nothing. Tell me that isn't going to make anyone feel like they don't matter, never mind someone with my history.

I do know my worth, I know I'm important. I'm also still triggered and choking a bit on those words at the moment. It's hard to put into words what's going on with me at the moment, but my self esteem has been taking a serious beating. Not just those triggers, but the ADHD stuff. The meds are doing nothing, the ones before these set me backwards, attempts to find a decently supportive discussion group/forum on the topic have proven useless, I tried opening a thread here in the Staying Well section on the topic of strategies to help that got precisely zero responses... I feel like an utter failure in trying to improve my life in this area, my attempts have if anything resulted in more stress and worse symptoms. I keep cycling back to feeling stupid and weak and angry with myself. I've always been a hard taskmaster with myself, but I don't think I've ever felt this bad about myself before. It really sucks.

Of course I still talk to you, and I think I understand you pretty well. You are likewise significant to me and have helped me work out a whole bunch of crap about my experience I hadn't nailed down yet. That matters. I appreciate you, too.

Songs from Puffballs.

Blue.

Dear Blue

That sucks so much. I completely agree the victim pays the whole way. IDK the answers, if there are any. If there's one thing I know about you, you're thorough!

You've already gone down every avenue you could go down to rectify this situation.

I really hate it when we get to that point in the road when we look around and say "Ok so there are NO good options. NONE."
I certainly know how I FEEL at that point - powerless.
Yet we KNOW we have to forge forward and we're exhausted.

With your lack of contented sleep and the ADHD driving you nuts, no wonder you're feeling the way you are atm. I'm sure there's other stuff happening or that's happened.
And altho the situation with MIL was a "good" outcome - it's not a comfortable position for you to be in.
I might be jumping the line here by saying you could feel that you can't really trust MIL.

Basically it seems you can't trust many ppl in your life. The neighbours are just abusive.

I'm listening. I'm hearing you. I can't do anything about your situations there, but I hear you and validate ALL of your concerns right now.

I thought of you the other night when I watched an Episode of Marie Kondo's latest Netflix special.
I think it's Episode 2 when a lady with ADHD talks about how during her growing up years, her family were not supportive (I could hear ringings of her family were toxic to her but yeah...).
Anyway she really got to share SOME things that bothered her about her growing up and I thought "BLUE".
She was dealing with ADHD and just trying to "do it all".

What I've seen with ADHD sufferers (similar to PTSD sufferers) is that meds can help sometimes. But I've also known some ppl with ADHD for a really long time and they've been so frustrated at their need to change meds all the time; increase them change them entirely, go through the "let's see if this works" periods.... It's a really horrible affliction to seek appropriate meds for from whom I've known.

There's no cure.

I'm concerned you could be dealing with PTSD in some form also.

Right now in these most challenging of times (new diagnoses / trialling meds / horrid neighbours / other stuff)..
you really need:
Sleep
Calm
Peace
Rest
Comfort
Validation

Answers.

you're pushed into a corner with strife to deal with inside your mind and outside it IRL too..
just grab ANY time to sleep, ANY time to rest, tons of self-care, lots of healthy food.

Release pressure just for x long. You need a rest.

Love you
EMxxxx

Dear Blue - plus a wave to EM~

Yes, you are right, there are many situations where the victim (if you want to use that term, some do not like it, suffer more if they try to take action.

This is a terrible situation, just off the top om my head I can think both of the continuation of the original problem plus adding to the suffering -for example if you call uncooperative cops. Also the fact that constant powerlessness erodes the feelings of self-worth and produces anger, frustration and concentration.

I wish I had an answer, I guess the only thing I can offer is that when I feel others are being recalcitrant, is to try to go down other avenues where I know I am good. It does not cure the original problem but can help me cope -does that make any sense?

Plus there is talking with understanding folk's such as the LM and of course EM. I imagine this both a comfort and maybe even at times a source of entertainment (EM, no disrespect meant)

As for your thread not being populated, it happens, particularly if the subject is specialized. I don't know if you remember but we used to have a thread called "Thread Killer" by a champ named Gruffud who is no longer writing here. It ironically became quite a long thread, but that was only becuse it became a vehicle for humor, not an explanation of why some threads end or do not take off.

You do so many things well you lift others just by talking

Croix

Dear EM,

It really does suck. The fight's not over, I'm still finding stones to turn over - even the ones I turned last time, as it's been a few years and here's bloody hoping something in the system may have changed (hardy-freaking-har).

It's not like I haven't been in places where there appear to be no good options, before. Sometimes that means drastic measures I had no desire to take, like selling up and moving. Sometimes just getting some space to put that stuff away and come back to it with a more rested mind. The latter is rather hard to do in situations like this, of course, when one is not allowed rest and peace. I guess at least here it's mostly on the week-ends, not every damn day like the last place. For now, anyway.

Yeah, exhaustion and ADHD (considerably exacerbated by exhaustion), the MIL situation... it's all taken a hell of a lot out of me. Whether or not trust can be rebuilt with MIL, it has been gone a long time, so yeah - that's not cut and dried, and no, I don't feel like there are an awful lot of people in my life I can trust. Even the ones in my physical environment I know do care are mostly hopelessly dysfunctional and thereby rather unreliable. That in itself feeds into my triggers.

You said: "I'm listening. I'm hearing you. I can't do anything about your situations there, but I hear you and validate ALL of your concerns right now." Sometimes that's enough, EM. Especially for someone who has gone so much of their life unheard and invalidated by others. Thank you.

Interesting. Sounds like Marie Kondo is delving into more than just stuff in her new series. Might have to have a goosie.

Yeah, I'm not loving all the crap with working out meds. I'll try upping the dose of what I've got until either it works or it proves pointless. Beyond that, I don't know that I'm willing to bother with them any further. I do know there's only so much you can do for ADHD without meds, but I've gone this long without them, and so far being on them has done more harm than good. There are limits to how long I'm willing to put myself through that.

As for PTSD (or C-PTSD)... well, that's exactly what my other thread is about. I'd be extremely surprised if I don't have it. There are overlaps with ADHD symptoms, but there are notable differences also. The signs are there for both.

Trying to self-care. Failing somewhat in the sleep dept. - this week-end was a nightmare with neighbours + early starts at work. Some good food, nature & brief meditations.

Blue.

Dear Croix,

I'm sure you've intuited that I'm one of those people a bit allergic to the word "victim". I prefer to think of myself as a solid opponent in a fight. I don't always win, but be damned if I won't leave 'em with a black eye or two. Sadly there are times when I take a few too many knocks and wake up later in financial ruin (hands down the most common consequence of the fights that don't go well). Sigh.

Yes, the lack of (legal) avenues to pursue in situations like this really do batter the sense of self-worth, and boy is there frustration and out and out rage. The rage fuels my will to fight, then the fight fizzles with lack of options/legal recourse and hello depression again. Neat.

I think what you are saying is that if I can't solve that particular problem, it could alleviate stress to tackle a different problem? I could be interpreting wrongly, but if not, that is actually one of my main coping mechanisms. A bit problematic when in the immediate I must sleep and just plain can't. Friday night got so bad the stress/adrenaline cancelled out the effect of a sleeping tablet (pro-active solution though that usually is) and that got followed up with a hellish day at work - sales went nuts, the morning being almost as bad as during lockdown (for context, my department tripled in sales/workload compared to normal whilst in lockdown).

Yes, there is some comfort in talking to those such as LM, EM and indeed yourself. Being understood and not looking like a mad banshee to those whose opinion I value has some merit.

Valid point about the thread, though there's usually at least one or two answers, even if it's just the verbal equivalent of smile and nod. Never had one fizz that bad, before. I've suggested on the Improvements thread that there should be a section for neurodiverse people - that at least has been agreed upon by a few others. There's no suitable space for people dealing with ADHD or ASD, and it's a mess finding threads about it, the search function on here sucks. Now you mention it, I do remember Gruffud and I did see the "Thread Killer" thread, though I don't recall if I read anything from it. There's room for humour on a subject like that, but it's a shame that took over from the topic itself.

Do I lift others just by talking? I dunno, but I certainly appreciate you saying so.

Kind thoughts to you & Mrs C, and treats for the Menagerie (which I am sure they will saunter off with as expected tributes).

Blue.

Hey Blue

Yeah I think you'll really like the new Marie Kondo series and esp the episode of the lady who's married to an Australian guy and is trying to cope with ADHD and talks about her "not so supportive family" when she was younger (and now!) which I think brought some of her tears out.
Quite beautiful.
I thought that last series of hers also dealt with pain of loss and heartbreak etc.

Anyway there are certainly emotions stored in some of our belongings.
Probably another reason why you and I are SO HEADSTRONG when it comes to protecting our current HOMES.

IDK but not having a "good" home when we were younger is probably exacerbating a schema thing there too.
I for 100% sure it does for me!

Well my empathy is with you and I reckon I'm gonna be WITH you in that boat all too soon!
The new owners of next door are renting the house out to tenants. We've had some lovely renters in our street but only about 1/4 are renters. And we've had some absolute NIGHTMARES of tenants in our street.
We have enough heavy partiers in our block as it is. Eye roll.

Ahh just got to wait and see who moves in!

I'm hearing you about the meds merry-go-round. Seen so much of it myself. Ppl tearing their hair out about it all then YAY something works.
Then it seems to wear off.
Then all avenues again.
Hard yakka.
Go with your gut instincts is all I have to say about it all, ever.

Blues about the PTSD thing. I seriously don't know how you WOULDN'T have it, not that I want you to have it at all! NO!
But the stuff in Childhood AND adulthood, I mean yeah. You mention being triggered about all sorts and that reminds me of me before I had trauma psych treatment. Not that she was an ACE psych, she wasn't even, though she's a published author on the subject. Her field was more specifically after an accident, most of her clients were ex Armed forces, police, ambulance workers.
Not FV / DV sufferers.
So she didn't understand it at all.

In fact she didn't think I COULD have it but after the Assessment, I scored so high, she stamped that diagnosis easily then set to work. We only worked ok together for 3 sessions but still in those sessions I was suspicious of her because of what she said eg I have to give up work, I wouldn't be ABLE to work etc etc.

It was the process of Individual Exposure Therapy she taught me that was a boon to my life.
Very healing in so many ways.

Hope you can get more answers to help you.

Love you lots!
EMxxxx