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Forums / Long term support over the journey / Sexual Health and the Idea of Never Having a Partner

Topic: Sexual Health and the Idea of Never Having a Partner

  1. Azzdog
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    426 posts
    10 July 2018

    Hi everyone, I'm not sure how to put this but hopefully it will make sense.

    I am a 24 year old male who currently is in therapy and sees a psychologist regularly. I have OCD, anxiety, depression, and autism, and when you put those all together, it becomes understandable why socialising is a major problem for me. One major cause of my current situation is the fact that I have never hd a girlfriend or had sex. Because we live in the digital age, it is almost impossible to avoid the fact that a lot of people are in relationships and that modern society is obsessed with the concept of sex. You would almost have to live on a deserted island in order to completely avoid all the triggers associated with it.

    My cause of concern is that I have no one that I can relate to on this and that I feel like I struggle to articulate how bad it is for my mental health. My psychologist says that I am well in the normal distribution for young men but that doesn't really make me feel any better. Because I am shy, introverted, and have a lot of hobbies and interests that are not in line with contemporary society, I genuinely feel like I will never have a girlfriend, never have sex, and die alone. This fact alone has meant in the past 6 months, I have had 5 separate stints in a psychiatric ward due to concerns of my own safety. I was wondering if there are any other young men out there who feel the same way and are currently in the same boat, and if there are any young mens health groups around? I feel the latter would be important for me and reassure me that I am not the only one who feels this way.

    1 person found this helpful
  2. Quercus
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    10 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Hi Azzdog and welcome to the forums,

    I'm not young or male or single so maybe it won't seem I can relate or be very helpful but I wanted you to know we are reading and do care.

    Reading your post reminded me of the story of another young man on the forums. Your psychologist is absolutely right you are not alone ot weird or abnormal at all. If you read this thread you'll find others who understand through experience what you're feeling...

    https://www.beyondblue.org.au/get-support/online-forums/long-term-support-over-the-journey/i-just-feel-like-i-have-no-chance-

    Also in the social zone there is a thread for under 25s which you may like to introduce yourself and find younger members like yourself to seek out.

    I can understand your specific situation feels hopeless and causes you massive anxiety. What sort of steps are you able and willing to make for yourself to meet others (not just women) offline?

    I think that you understand best your own limitations and needs. Is joining a class or hobby or club you enjoy weekly something that is achievable? Basically getting yourself out and talking to people with shared interests is a good place to start. What do you think?

    I hope you can keep talking to us here. The forums have a lot to offer to you and we'd like to know more about you too.

    Nat

    3 people found this helpful
  3. MsPurple
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    10 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    HI Azzdog

    Like Nat I myself can not completely relate as I am a 26 year old female in a relationship. However I have not always been in a relationship. Before this one I had been single for over 5 years. I felt like with my mental illness I wouldn't find anyone. I had given up looking and just decided to live my life. Then I met someone without putting all my efforts into it. I find when you are not looking then you may find someone then. It is ok to take some time to find someone. I have several friends that didn't get into their first relationship till after 25. It is ok to take some time to find someone. I know we feel pressure from society and movies to find someone, get married and have kids but this extra pressure isn't good for us and we need to let it be in good time.

    2 people found this helpful
  4. Azzdog
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    426 posts
    11 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Hey I’m really thankful that the two of you replied, I really appreciate it.

    I have taken a number of steps in the past 6 years to try to meet new people. A lot of those have been general social meetings and they have never gone as well as I would have hoped. I am currently speaking to my case manager and occupational therapist about structuring a plan to build a social life now but there is a part of me that feels like it’s too late. I’m so bitter and twisted inside that it makes me so angry to see people in relationships. I’m like “what makes you so interesting that makes you attractive to other people?” Particularly if it’s guys I went to school with who have never had an intelligent thought in their life. What’s the deal? Why are these guys preferred over ones who are a bit introverted but actually have a lot to offer to someone? It does my head in. I have tried online dating, name a website/app and believe me I’ve tried it. Nothing to show for it at all which makes me suicidal, ugly, and completely boring.

    I have a broad range of interests. I LOVE music. I’ve been playing guitar for 11 years and I like to write songs in my spare time. I have a wide range of cds but particularly like late 70s early 80s rock music. I study history and English at uni and plan to go into teaching. I do like my sport but have no interest in resuming playing football or cricket, but am interested in pursuing table tennis or pool. I read classic literature and exercise daily. Basically I’m an old soul which it makes me feel like there is no hope whatsoever for me.

    I have always found that when people say to me “you are young” “it will take time”, I always feel like that is a throwaway line when it all gets too hard to find something more helpful to say. I despise cliches and want some more resolute answers rather than just throwaway lines. I’m almost certainly convinced that women find me incredibly repulsive and ugly and I don’t see what a few days down the road is going to change. All I’ve done in life is give, give, give and people (particularly women) use that as an excuse to walk over me and I’ve had it. Sex is all around me and people say “you just have to accept it” and think that’s all they need to say to make me feel better. It doesn’t.

    Sorry for the long message but I feel utterly hopeless right now.

  5. Croix
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    11 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Dear Azzdog~

    I hope you don't mind me popping and and talking for a moment. I read your original post and also your reply to Nat and MsPurple. What struck me was two things. First the things you said about your life interests and abilities are attractive and should be a great base to get to know others and just as importantly for others to get to know you.

    The other thing is because you have never been in a relationship you feel despondent, angry and that things are not going to get better. I agree the way society is relationships and sex are pushed into view by everything from advertising to movies. The sight of others paired off too can lead to bitterness.

    Please forgive me for guessing however do you think it is possible the fact you are unhappy and despondent, even angry, stops you from simply enjoying others' company, and stops others enjoying yours? Seeing each person as a potential answer to your problems does make for a pretty intense situation, and magnifies the disappointment when things do not work out.

    I'm not saying I'm right, just asking your opinion. Even if I was I've no instant answer other than to try to 'see' other people just for their own sake.

    Do you think that giving is the answer, or is it too one sided, leading to resentment? Perhaps you try to give too much.

    I've no idea if this is helpful, at least it will make a change from “you are young” “it will take time”.

    Croix

    3 people found this helpful
  6. geoff
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    12 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Hi Azzdog, welcome to the site and I'm pleased you have joined the forum.

    As you can see I'm a male and I'm not going to say 'it will take time' nor what else people are saying to you because that doesn't help you or solve your problem.

    I want to concentrate on your music, that's the avenue where you can meet people and the suggestions I make you might say 'no', but I want you to have a think about them:

    -dating sites only make people lose money, promise the world but frustrate people

    -playing music will be able to control your OCD, it's when you stop your habits may begin, learn how to hide these, that will help

    -put a sign up on a signboard, look in the paper for someone needed for a band, perhaps you can go to a pub and introduce yourself

    -there are many job agents you can go to look for jobs playing or joining a band

    I'm only saying this because if you can join a band then you will have dozens of girls wanting to go out with you

    -if you are able to handle your anxiety then perhaps you could play by yourself, starting at a pub or a RSL

    I'd like to know how bad your OCD is as I also have it, but I'm not as clever as you and play the guitar, you have an opening here which doesn't seem to be utilised.

    If you see a friend with their partner, try not to think negative thoughts, that will close your mind and you may miss the opportunity that a girl is looking out for you.

    Lety us know what you think.

    Geoff.

    4 people found this helpful
  7. Azzdog
    Azzdog avatar
    426 posts
    12 July 2018

    Thanks Croix and Geoff for replying, I will try to address both of you here.

    Croix, you do make a good point about me being angry makes me unable to enjoy others or my own company. I would say that only when I’m overwhelmed with emotion does that happen. Socialising does make me feel a lot better but if I’m with my thoughts a lot then it’s so hard to enjoy others company. I feel like thaive never been allowed to ‘take’ if that makes sense? I’ve always been there for people to lend a helping hand but when it’s me it all of a sudden become too much and apparently me talking about myself is the wrong way of going about it. I just don’t know how to change that.

    Geoff, your idea of concentrating on music is a great idea. I wouldn’t know the first thing about putting up a notice about it and I don’t particularly like pubs because I don’t drink alcohol. Girls have never been interested in me playing guitar even back to school days where I could play the majority of Stairway to Heaven. I’m interested in the idea but have no way of going about it.

  8. Croix
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    12 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Dear Azzdog~

    Thanks for your reply, I guess what I was trying to say was because of myself and my habits. I find it is easy to offer help, to do something, because it is a familiar path I've been down before in social settings. Now I"m not suggesting being helpful is wrong, its part of the glue that holds society together, but it can get in the way, where one is concentrating on the helpful task, and not the other person.

    Maybe rather than a knack of helpful one might try for a knack of asking the sort of questions that not only gets people talking but makes them feel comfortable too. I remember one young lady who was very happy to talk about her dad's small property and the animals on it (I ended up marrying her)

    Again I'm just thinking out loud and may be well off track - what do you think?

    Croix

  9. Azzdog
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    426 posts
    12 July 2018 in reply to Croix

    Hey Croix,

    I feel like that’s something that I have done in the past, and still do. I ask questions of people that aligns would their interests and gets them taking to make them comfortable. I know I have done that since high school. I think the problem back then was the fact I wasn’t good at expressing my interests which is something I’m a lot better at now. The problem is I don’t have a lot of people to interact with (which is something my case manager and I are working on at the moment).

    I guess my problem stems from the fact that I’m not a typical 24 year old. I don’t drink, I don’t go clubbing, I prefer The Who over any current artist today, I read the classics, I’m a political junkie, and I’m a deep thinker on many issues. I’m someone that you need to take time with to build a friendship/relationship and I feel that a lot of people my generation (particularly women, I can’t stress that enough) don’t have the patience. I have looked at dating coaches but I feel they are just looking for the highest bidder rather than genuinely wanting to help young men like myself who would be so grateful to understand what is wrong with me. Like I feel I am fundamentally flawed and I’m an ugly, pathetic, disgusting creature who really doesn’t give value to anyone on this planet. It hurts so much to see people in relationships and I struggle to understand what I’m doing wrong and they are doing right.

  10. Croix
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    12 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Dear Azzdog~

    The descriptions of the things you do, your likes and interests are just fine. I honestly don't think that they are any sort of bar, and I know you are wrong about women, they are half the human population and some think deeply and have patience, some don't, just like the other half.

    I worry about your view of yourself. Sadly when you are trying to find a relationship and have not succeeded there is an awful temptation to see oneself at fault, and I believe that in turn sends out vibes which make others pause. This in turn makes things worse, a circle.

    I know what I'm trying to say might seem unconnected but what achievable things do you think would make you feel better about yourself? What are you good at? What do you enjoy?

    So what's wrong with The Who? Pinball Wizard rules.

    Croix

  11. Azzdog
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    426 posts
    13 July 2018 in reply to Croix

    Dear Croix

    Oh no there is absolutely nothing wrong with The Who, its just that my musical tastes are quite old fashioned and that could potentially put people off. I mean, have you heard of Killing Joke? They are an 80s band that are still around today but it would be amazing if I was to find someone who like that style of music considering thats the kind of music I write.

    I have been thinking recently about that. I think what I think of myself does send of vibes that could put people off but what can I do to change that? Being rejected since year 7 has done that to me. I'm not talking about rejection from women but from most people. I can be quite intense but thats because I am someone who thinks very deeply about the world and my place in it.

    I've actually started to get into tutoring. I have an interview next week and hopefully something comes of that. It might give me more self-confidence. That seems like something achievable. I am talking with a friend about starting a band and my psychologist and I are going to build up an advertisement to put up to encourage some people to join a band.

    I just got discharged from hospital by the way. So thats probably why my last message had some heavy points in it.

  12. Croix
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    14 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Dear Azzdog~

    Well I'm glad you are out of hospital. If you are like me I worried a lot that any improvements I might have made would be lost in the pressures of the outside world, fortunately not the case. So how are you finding things?

    You did ask but what can I do to change that? Well I was sort of trying to think along those lines when I was asking what you could do that was achievable and you might enjoy or feel good about yourself. The band sounds pretty good, and tutoring will let you meet people.

    I was not familiar with Killing Joke, but having played a couple of their numbers (Kings & Queens, A New Day) reminds me a bit of Switchblade Symphony.

    Croix

  13. Azzdog
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    426 posts
    14 July 2018 in reply to Croix

    Kings and Queens and A New Day are cool songs. You should check out Eighties and Requiem. They are post-punk classics.

     

    I'm actually struggling a bit at the moment. Being out in the real world makes you see all these triggers and all the triggers are practically everywhere. There is a part of me that would like to stay in hospital for the rest of my life. I am trying to distract myself a lot but I'm incredibly sad at the moment. It eats me up on the inside to see people in relationships. I feel like I have a lot of interests but there is nothing I can really do. Women are so picky and I just want to give up.

  14. Croix
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    14 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Dear Azzdog~

    I think I prefer Eighties, mainly for the guitar work.

    Coming out of hospital can be pretty hard, it is after all supposed to be a protecting environment, and the real world does seem rather a contrast, still you have the wisdom to recognize triggers, I guess now finding ways of coping with them has to be on the menu. Can I ask what strategies you have for when you react to something?

    As for not being able to do anything, I think you are already, even if you have not seen any results yet. The idea of the band is pretty good, and trying for tutoring is a step too.

    Honestly I don't think it is women that are being picky, I think it is you. You are so hard on yourself, and whenever you think you fall short of the standards you impose on yourself you get discouraged. I"m please you have a psych who sounds on your side, it makes a difference.

    Do you play any Killing Joke guitar parts? If so which do you find hard?

    Croix

  15. Azzdog
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    426 posts
    15 July 2018 in reply to Croix

    Dear Croix,

    There was something in your last statement that made me really angry. Saying that women aren’t picky. Why is it that I get no responses on dating sites, why is it that women do everything they can to avoid me. Why do they chase after thick skulled simpletons and the. Cry out that there are no nice guys out there? They absolutely are and it’s hard for guys like me to be taken seriously in this world because we are shy and introverted and that makes us look a little weird. You know I haven’t always been like this? Only for about a year and a half. I didn’t have any standards then so why don’t I have anything to show for it? Women are so picky and it infuriates me. It’s why I’ve been to hospital so many times because I can’t work out what is wrong with me. I hate myself and I want to die because I clearly have nothing that is attractive about me. You may think so but I have no one. You do. I don’t. It’s because I am ugly ugly person to look at and a personality as interesting as watching paint dry. I’m in so much pain over this and I’ve asked for more social things to do over the past year from my psych. She did sweet fa. Now they are but I’m afraid I’m too demented in the head to be able to fix what’s wrong with me. I’m going in tomorrow to tell my therapist that life in the real world is too hard. I have a broad range of interests and yet there are men out there who can’t put coherent sentences together and treat women like shit get all the sex they want. What a great world we live in and I’m still yet to meet anyone either here or otherwise that is in the same boat as me. God I can’t explain this anymore. I’ve tried and tried but women despise me.

    1 person found this helpful
  16. Croix
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    15 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Dear Azzdog~

    It only takes one to be the friend you want, and I'm trying to let you see that's all it takes, maybe I'm not putting it right so you can see. Sure you can be angry at times, and you are down on yourself, but underneath is an interesting and thoughtful person. I'm not trying to deny you have had hard times and maybe not enough luck, just there is more hope, and you are a better person than you realize.

    I came to the conclusion a long time ago it was not a lack of suitable people to be with me, it was difficulty in meeting them. Society is not realy set up to meet people in lots of ways. Sure there are dating sites, bars and so on, but not everyone uses them, in fact I'd suspect more don't than do.

    You sound very unhappy at the moment, do you have something to do that helps right now, maybe play the guitar or just listen. Can you compose? When things pile on top of me one of the things I do is walk and imagine a special place I knew as a kid, on a cliff by the sea, with blustery strong winds, short sheep grazed turf and the sounds of the waves. Makes me feel small compared to nature and my trouble lesses for a while

    I guess I'm saying hang in there

    Croix

    2 people found this helpful
  17. Doolhof
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    16 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Hi Azzdog,

    The more frustrated I become about a situation or an issue the worse it seems to become before it has a chance to get better or for me to even look at it logically.

    My mind can run away with itself and tell me all kinds of stories, yes, there might be some truth in what I am thinking, but how much of it is exaggerated clap trap?

    If you keep telling yourself you will not meet some one ever, than you may well live your life in such a fashion that your self prophesising actually does come true. We can do this unconsciously at times.

    At times when life doesn't go as I want it to, I sometimes have to "float" for a while, to just relax my expectations, check out what is achievable and see how I might be able to go about getting my goals met.

    Okay, so you are wanting a relationship and sex. Some people have sex without a relationship! Are you hoping for a meaningful relationship or just sex? Not everyone in a relationship has sex. not everyone in a relationship is happy.

    I can clearly read how frustrated you are. I am just wondering how you approach women? If you have been rejected by a few women, that does not mean that every woman on earth hates you. When we already have pre-conceived ideas on how something will be, we can portray that when we meet people.

    We can push people away before we have a chance to really meet each other.

    As you have already mentioned, women are attracted to men for many different reasons. It is not always because a person is beautiful or handsome that they attract another person. Personality, character, presence, and so many other things help add to a sense of attraction.

    If you totally disagree with what I have written that is okay too. I just know there are times when I have to let go of my anger and frustration, to accept things I can't change before I can move on.

    Cheers from Dools

    3 people found this helpful
  18. future_
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    40 posts
    16 July 2018 in reply to Doolhof
    I wish everyone was in a relationship that is what makes the humans better people. No judging of people at all. Humans need someone to care for and live with to enjoy happiness outside of work. Pets are great but they dont offer the full humantalking, helping, working together experience and they can take up alot of time looking after their toilet needs or vet needs that there is no time left for your humans needs in a relationship. Please lord grant everyone a loving relationship with a partner, sexual or not sexual.
  19. james1
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    16 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Hello Azzdog,

    I am 26 and I also prefer The Who over, say, Kendrick Lamar. I prefer to draw on my own than to go clubbing or even to go to someone's house party. Or even lunch with friends, because, well, I just don't like socialising. So in a way, I understand a bit about how you feel about being different and not at all desirable. This is the first time I've admitted it, but I've probably paid about $400 to bloody dating sites. I got 1 swipe in a year from Tinder (and she ignored my message), let alone from the other places too. It's quite sad.

    I don't know what to say. I can see that you are feeling really isolated from females and even angry that they choose other people. It can feel like all the females are taken and then it's just us alone, forever. That can really hurt.

    I also think women are picky. But out of curiosity, have you ever thought about what the women you don't see are like? The ones who don't turn up on instagram or facebook or whatever people use for social media. Who don't go clubbing. Don't go on tinder. The ones that you don't see.

    I imagine they would be feeling pretty hurt as well by the fact that guys only seem to be going for the other girls.

    So I agree with you - women are picky. But so are men. I think there are many people, both men and women, who struggle with this.

    There seems to be such a painful gap inside you which wants to be understood. Will a relationship and sex help with that? (genuine question, for me I answered yes though I don't know how true it is)

    James

    5 people found this helpful
  20. smallwolf
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    16 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Hi,

    I read that you were a little put off by some comments in a earlier post. I also noticed that the things you like might not be mainstream. For example, you like "The Who", liking classic literature, politics etc. I also have no idea as to what the people like these days.

    I am also aware that people may or may not have, or like to use FB. But my first suggestion will use FB...

    One free way of meeting people might be to find a fan page of the group(s) you like and write a post there along the lines of "anyone here from X who want to catch up?". This way, you might get some responses from others, and that might broaden your group of contacts.

    You could do the same regarding your other interests?

    Personally speaking, I would not worry too much about finding GF. My wife was my first real GF and I would have met her around your age. I was invited to a party (tagged along with my brother) as they were all his friends. I never expected to meet anyone, it just happened.

    Could you tell me some of your positive attributes? Or what you like about earlier music and the books you read?

    This is instead of comparing yourself to others who maybe "thick skulled simpletons". It is OK to think this, but not something I would say out loud?

    Finally, and I am only asking this question, based on the thread title adn contents from your posts. Are you looking for (a GF for) sex? Or are you looking for a relationship? There are two separate things? One lasts for very short period of time? and the other continues for much longer?

    I hope that my questions are not too blunt, but to find real resolution to whatever the issues are needs these to be considered. And also determines what I might reply in my next post should you reply. I guess that I trying to understand what exactly you are looking form.

    Tim

  21. HoldingOnToHope
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    17 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Dear azzdog

    I am a lady, and single at the moment - for now by choice. I read a comment someone posted about have you thought about the women who are not on dating apps etc. I know i tried it for 2 weeks and was so overwhelmed with the comments and attention that i removed myself based on confusion rather than being picky. The few men i became friends with told me how quiet it is for them on it, whereas as a women i couldnt keep up with the attention, and i wasnt even showing my face in any of the pics. In short, dont take apps as an indication of your value, wht i realised is that there must be so many more men on it than women.

    I certainly know i will never go back on one.

    I loved another idea someone posted about hobbies, ive met the most lovely people through local Slacklining groups - theyre all over australia and i have found then to be particularly accepting and caring group of young people- and they love new faces. Im still hopeless at it, but i love the friends ive made.

    At the moment, im healing from some painful relationships that destroyed my self worth and although i feel so much stronger and better i know that a good relationship requires work and dedication. And ive realised that i want to just meet new people and have friends - without the sex. And i am enjoying it. Honestly. Sex for me is only good if you have a connection with the person. So my focus is buildong new friendships and the rest will come. And if it doesnt, i have still gained new hobbies and new friends.

    Everybody is different but for me hobbies that take me to the beautiful outdoors are so good for my mind and heart. I go stand up paddle boarding, am learning to kutesurf (another awesome micro community), go on hikes (there are plenty of meet ups. And most of us who go are women- wed love more males to join).

    All these things may help you meet new people, make new friends, feel good about yourself.... and love may be a little cherry on the top.

    I have a soft heart and and am saddened when i see men who feel all women are picky/moneyhungry/high maintenance. We're not all like that. Its just that those who are are possibly more in the focus of society, theyre out there.

    One of my personal favourite mottos is to not allow my bad/painful experiences make me Bitter, instead I want them to make me a better person.

    big cyber hug from me.

    6 people found this helpful
  22. Doolhof
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    17 July 2018 in reply to HoldingOnToHope

    Hi Holding On To Hope,

    I just want to thank you for this lovely message you have shared with us. Forming friendships is valuable, they help us become more fulfilled as does finding ways to fill in our days with positive experiences, new adventures hobbies, interests and happenings.

    It certainly sounds like you are finding ways to fulfil your life.

    sam gc,

    Yes, it would be wonderful if everyone was able to be in a stable, loving, caring, validating relationship having all their needs met. Even in a good relationship that is not always possible! Trying to find ways to create our own happiness can help with some of the loneliness we experience...even when in a relationship.

    Not all men are the same and not all women are the same either. Maybe we all need to be a little more considerate and respectful while trying to achieve our own goals in life.

    Friendships can happen over different age groups, different cultures, different sexes. Maybe we just need to be open to the opportunities out there.

    Cheers all from Dools

    1 person found this helpful
  23. Dniaiu
    Dniaiu avatar
    22 posts
    17 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Hi Azzdog,

    you're not the only one!! I just missed out on being the archetypical 40 year old virgin, with someone I thought was a girlfriend, but who was really only after jewellery, a car, a holiday, and a trip interstate to catch up with her family.
    I'm not tall, or physically attractive, I love reading, I don't drink, so I had adopted the strategy of trying to help people so that they might realise that although I wasn't a tall, handsome, muscular socialite, I wouldn't beat them, do drugs, get drunk, or cheat on them. Unfortunately, there are people out there who will prey on "helpful" people.

    Re: dating sites - in about 4 years on Tinder, POF, eHarmony, and RSVP, I have had 2 conversations, and 1 cup of coffee with a lady who immediately SMSed that "it was her, not me" and deleted/blocked her profile. It's not just you :)

    So, I feel I've been where you are. Moving forward, I have noted (in print, and received in advice) that asking for help is a key interaction to practice. (I'm not referring to seeking medical intervention for mental health issues, just "Will you hold the door for me, please?" type stuff)
    I'm self-reliant, and generally competent, so it went against the grain for me to ask for help, rather than be offering it, but it's worth researching this, as many people internally keep score, and can feel uncomfortable about being helped too much, rather than helping equalling being helped.
    Asking for help can actually help you feel better about yourself, as you are worth being helped, and most people feel good about being able to help someone else.
    So, as a practical suggestion, find small things to ask for help with - directions, passing you something, musical advice, recommend an electrician, then follow up with a "thanks" and a smile.

    Regards

    3 people found this helpful
  24. Azzdog
    Azzdog avatar
    426 posts
    18 July 2018

    Hi everyone, sorry for the late reply to some of you. I will try to address all the points made but feel free to say if I've missed anything.

    The one question I've noticed a lot is the one on do you want a girlfriend or sex? The answer is both but, being the socially anxious nervous nelly that I am, I would absolutely want to have a girlfriend first then sex. For me, it would not solve my problems and I am not naive enough to think that it would. I have body dysmorphia and having a girlfriend would challenge these preconceived notions I have about my personality, which I think is boring, and the way I look, where I think I'm hideously ugly. Women have ignored me my entire life and it would be reassuring to know its not because of my appearance but rather my poor ability in picking up social cues and social anxiety.

    I've always felt that women and men are picky, but then I see a guy who hasn't got his things together, isn't ambitious, doesn't really have any hobbies, and has an attractive girlfriend and I'm like why? What is it about him that is so damn attractive? I'm about to start my Masters of Teaching, I am about to start tutoring high school students, I have written over 40 songs in the past year and a half on my computer (where I have a program where I can write fully fledged compositions), I look after myself, treat people with respect, and want life for myself, and those around me, to be the best they can damn well be. I have spent more money on dating sites than I care to admit and obviously have nothing to show for it.

    The reason I like late 70s early 80s rock music, (and mid to late 60s rock music as well), is because of how exciting and innovative it was. Here was a young group of disenfranchised people from around the world, looking to take on the political and musical establishments by showing that anyone with a modicum of talent could be in a band as long as they worked hard enough to do it. Not only that it also put forward the "Straight Edge" movement in which I'm a proud member (even though there really isn't a group as such around). I've the last few days with a new keyboard I borrowed from someone writing some post-punk songs (in the vein of Killing Joke/Joy Division/New Order) which has helped give me some space from the thoughts, even though they are not far behind me. Thanks for all the responses everyone let me know what you all think.

  25. Croix
    Community Champion
    • Outstanding members who have volunteered their time to support others here on the forums
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    Croix avatar
    10373 posts
    18 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Dear Azzdog~

    That was a lovely detailed and thoughtful reply. Time taken is never a problem, you post when it makes sense. Perhaps I'm mistaken but I seem to see two different 'modes' of writing in your posts. There is of course the discussion over your lack of female companionship and how you feel as a result.

    There is also your views on music, which are not given by someone who is boring or limited. Add to that an ability to study, to compose and hopefully to teach. A pretty well-rounded person.

    Perhaps I'm wrong but maybe you feelings over lack of success with females are 'spilling over' when in female company. As an example there might never be a 'casual' interaction, as each is loaded with high stakes - eg: will it work out?

    This may not alow others to be at ease, despite your best efforts.

    Do you think I'm on the wrong track?

    I did like HoldingOnToHope's post, (sorry to talk about you in the 3rd person HOTH) it sounded very genuine and sensible and might give some insight into why dating sites, clubs and all only attract a small proportion of the female population. So thanks HOTH.

    I'm off to look up "Straight Edge"

    Croix

    2 people found this helpful
  26. BluBelle
    BluBelle avatar
    52 posts
    18 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    Hi Azzdog. I can identify with a lot of the frustration over dating that you've expressed here. I've been single for almost six years. As a fairly plain, overweight and introverted women in her 30s with regular bouts of crippling depression, men are not exactly lining up at my door. I do all the things people are supposed to do - travel, spend time with friends, focus on my career and hobbies, but I still get lonely and have to fight every day not to become bitter and self-loathing. I have also grown tired of platitudes like "you'll meet someone as soon as you stop looking" or "the right man is out there for you." The truth is, not everyone gets a fairy tale ending. I think about whether I'm able to make peace with the idea of being alone. I think I could, but I'd prefer not to.

    I spent most of my early 20s in the punk scene and had loads of straight edge mates. There are still straight edge girls out there too, as well as women who just prefer not to drink. There are women who have a genuine interest in the type of music you're into, other introverts, other women who battle mental health conditions. It's tough meeting fellow introverts - we so rarely go out!

    This may or may not be helpful, but I can tell you what makes me swipe right on a dating app. Conventional attractiveness has nothing to do with it for me, and for lots of women. I am attracted to photos where the guy looks like he is enjoying himself - travel photos, playing with their pet, playing in a band, etc. Whatever makes them smile. If there is any hint of aggressiveness or anger in the profile - complaining that nobody replies, things like "are there even any good women left out there?" it's a huge red flag for me. Just a simple description of interests and maybe a little joke is the best type of profile. If I do match, the best first message is asking a question about one of my photos or something in my profile. "Is that Italy in your photo? I've always wanted to go there!" etc. Don't talk about anything too intense up front, don't talk about sex straight away. You probably do all of this already, but that's what I look for anyway.

    3 people found this helpful
  27. Azzdog
    Azzdog avatar
    426 posts
    18 July 2018 in reply to Croix

    Dear Croix,

    Yeah I liked HoldingontoHope's post as well. However, it was something that has been brought to my attention in the past. Women do get approached more often which makes it harder for shy, introverted guys to make conversation. I don't know but I get the feeling, not just from women, but than any shy, introverted person seems to require too much effort to socialise with.

    I guess I have well rounded views on certain things because I've spent an enormous amount of time developing my interests and broadening my mind. I don't want to come across as smug or arrogant, far from it, but I do believe I understand this world better than more than half of the people my age. It's not necessarily a good thing because of the way politics is right now, it makes me really anxious and depressed about the future.

    You're not wrong at all. I was talking to one of my occupational therapists the other day about this exact issue. When I'm around men I don't think as much whereas around women I put too much pressure on myself to say the right things and be as exciting as possible. I can't seem to find the middle ground where I can just be myself and not have to be this extraordinary person. I'm not extraordinary, I know I'm flawed, but I feel very inferior to be around women than men.

  28. Azzdog
    Azzdog avatar
    426 posts
    18 July 2018 in reply to BluBelle

    Hi BluBelle, thank you for taking the time to respond.

    I guess the problem is hard to avoid isn't it? Almost impossible. The problem here being that the idea of falling in love and living happily ever after is such a beautiful image that most people would love to achieve. It's all over in popular music, movies, t.v. shows, advertisements. It really does my head in. I am so with you on platitudes like "you'll meet someone as soon as you stop looking". I spent the best part of 6 years doing that and absolutely nothing happened! It is counterintuitive when you think about it. Is that the same logic that that person applies when they are finding a job? "You'll get a job as soon as you stop looking". I know what they are trying to say, as in put your focus on your hobbies and interests, but it comes across as condescending.

    That sounds awesome that you were in the punk scene! Are you still into punk? I don't know anyone who has any sort of interest in punk apart from like Blink-182 and Green Day. Personally, I don't really consider them as punk anyway. Green Day, maybe, but not Blink-182. I prefer the classics like The Clash and The Ramones. It sucks that those kinds of introverts I'll probably never meet. I was once called 'Un-Australian' because I don't drink alcohol. Pretty ridiculous right?

    Unfortunately, while I do have lots of pictures from my time in South-East Asia, I don't like photos of myself due t my body dysmorphia. I have never taken a selfie and the photos I have on dating sites are okay but not really showing all my interests. I can't look in a mirror alone look at a picture of myself. I never talk about sex ever on dating sites. I genuinely want to get to know the other person but that doesn't really seem to go anywhere. I always mention something about one of their photos or in their profile for the first message, still doesn't get me anywhere though.

  29. BluBelle
    BluBelle avatar
    52 posts
    18 July 2018 in reply to Azzdog

    People in relationships are often condescending without meaning to be. Especially people who have been attached for a long time and don't know just how tough dating is these days. I think loneliness is about like hitting your thumb with a hammer, once the pain is gone you forget just how bad it was!

    I do still listen to some punk. Usually bands like Bad Religion, NOFX, Against Me, etc. I like some heavier stuff too - straight edge kinda came out of punk/hardcore with Minor Threat. Most straight edge kids I knew were able to band together and avoid some of those judgements from the general population.

    I'm sorry to hear you have body dysmorphia. I'm not familiar with it myself but I imagine it makes things difficult. Would it help if someone else chose some nice photos of you and put them up on your profile? That way you wouldn't have to look at them. Bumble might be a good alternative dating app, as the women have to message you first which can take the pressure off!

    1 person found this helpful
  30. Azzdog
    Azzdog avatar
    426 posts
    18 July 2018 in reply to BluBelle

    Only people in relationships have that condescending attitude towards how hard it is for us singles to make sense of the dating world. I struggle to see how it will change for me and I get very angry about it but what's the point?

    Ah yeah. Bad Religion are really good. I don't own much of their stuff though but I do like some of their material. I wouldn't know where any of the punk scenes are and I would be too scared to go even if I knew where they were. I'm not good at meeting new people, even more so at a high octane event. The life of someone with social anxiety is tragic really.

    It makes things really hard. I can't go to the movies anymore in case there are actors that make me feel insecure about the way I look. There are certain t.v. shows and topics in music I can't listen to as well. It makes it hard to live. I actually did. The problem is that there weren't many photos to begin with. Its a bit sad really. Don't get me started on Bumble. People told me it would be a good app to go on and I have been on there over a year and have had only one conversation on it that ended abruptly. In my opinion its just as bad as tinder is.

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